Minnesota Sports Forum

Regardless of who the coach is... if being asked to excel is a reason Wiggins leaves...

Shouldn't that be on the player? (to be fair, cool does say it's unlikely it even happens)

For everything written and said about Thibodeau... there is nothing to substantiate that he alienates players to that point. In fact, the Bulls locker room has proven to be even more dysfunctional since his departure with "nice guy" Hoiberg at the helm.

Everything seems to be about hearsay and a lot of assumptions, etc.

How much stock each of us put into them depends on how much each of us want somebody else here.

AbeVigodaLive wrote:Regardless of who the coach is... if being asked to excel is a reason Wiggins leaves...

Shouldn't that be on the player? (to be fair, cool does say it's unlikely it even happens)

For everything written and said about Thibodeau... there is nothing to substantiate that he alienates players to that point. In fact, the Bulls locker room has proven to be even more dysfunctional since his departure with "nice guy" Hoiberg at the helm.

Everything seems to be about hearsay and a lot of assumptions, etc.

How much stock each of us put into them depends on how much each of us want somebody else here.

You know that's not the issue here, nor what I'm saying.

CoolBreeze44 wrote:

monsterpile wrote:Britt with his take on the search. Nothing earth shattering but he covers a lot of the considerations.

https://www.minnpost.com/sports/2016/04/wolves-have-some-great-coaching-candidates-hiring-right-one-still-crapshoot

From that article one thing really worries me, and it's this passage:

But the Wolves' path to championship contention is more likely a 3-6 year process than 2-3 seasons, and the danger is that Thibodeau burns out his roster, physically and mentally, with his competitive zeal and in-your-face style. It would be especially interesting to see how he and Wiggins -- an enigmatic, at least outwardly taciturn personality -- interact. One of Mitchell's virtues this past season was not badgering Wiggins as much as he did LaVine and Towns, in the belief that more private consultation was the way to get through to him.

With most of you jumping on the Thibodeau train, I feel the need to be the voice of reason here. If the hiring of Thibodeau causes Wiggins to lose interest in this situation and look for alternate homes at the end of his rookie deal, this would be a terrible hire. I'm not suggesting it's a likely outcome (Wiggins leaving because of Thibs), but if there is a chance of that happening the whole project could be derailed just like that. We can simply not afford anyone that is going to alienate our star players. We're not LA or NY where you can find replacements relatively easily. We MUST keep this group together if we are going to maximize this run. This is a legitimate concern and it's what scares me about Thibodeau getting the gig.

If this were the case, then I don't think Wiggins is the player people expected....and I would question our teams willingness to offer max dollars to a weak-minded player. This passive attitude crap is why everyone is so entitled today. Oooo, you are mean, and actually have expectations of me.....therefore, I will quit and go play somewhere else where they "appreciate" me more. It's why marriages last less than 50% of the time....people aren't willing to work for the things that matter. In the end, if Wiggins wants out because it is "too hard" with Thibs coaching, then I don't want Andrew on this team. End of rant.

CoolBreeze44 wrote:

monsterpile wrote:Britt with his take on the search. Nothing earth shattering but he covers a lot of the considerations.

https://www.minnpost.com/sports/2016/04/wolves-have-some-great-coaching-candidates-hiring-right-one-still-crapshoot

From that article one thing really worries me, and it's this passage:

But the Wolves' path to championship contention is more likely a 3-6 year process than 2-3 seasons, and the danger is that Thibodeau burns out his roster, physically and mentally, with his competitive zeal and in-your-face style. It would be especially interesting to see how he and Wiggins -- an enigmatic, at least outwardly taciturn personality -- interact. One of Mitchell's virtues this past season was not badgering Wiggins as much as he did LaVine and Towns, in the belief that more private consultation was the way to get through to him.

With most of you jumping on the Thibodeau train, I feel the need to be the voice of reason here. If the hiring of Thibodeau causes Wiggins to lose interest in this situation and look for alternate homes at the end of his rookie deal, this would be a terrible hire. I'm not suggesting it's a likely outcome (Wiggins leaving because of Thibs), but if there is a chance of that happening the whole project could be derailed just like that. We can simply not afford anyone that is going to alienate our star players. We're not LA or NY where you can find replacements relatively easily. We MUST keep this group together if we are going to maximize this run. This is a legitimate concern and it's what scares me about Thibodeau getting the gig.

I think this is a valid point cool. Everyone has a learning style that is best matched to a unique style of teaching. I don't get the sense that Wiggins has a huge chip on his shoulder to begin with because his upbringing was relatively comfortable. So as an educator the perspective i would take with him would not be hard nosed at all, but rather in logically explaining the benefits of details to his game and repeatedly pointing to positive results. I think Sam accomplished this to a certain extant based on Wiggins improvements so far, and I think JVG would be able to fully utilize this approach. The point that there is not one path to excellence, and that teaching should be adapted to personality types is more than valid. Changing culture should be taken into account. There is a reason that Bobby Knight became ineffective at his job. Great post.

It's still a players league so some of these things are worth bringing up or having some level of concern about. How much? idk

Hicks123 wrote:

CoolBreeze44 wrote:

monsterpile wrote:Britt with his take on the search. Nothing earth shattering but he covers a lot of the considerations.

https://www.minnpost.com/sports/2016/04/wolves-have-some-great-coaching-candidates-hiring-right-one-still-crapshoot

From that article one thing really worries me, and it's this passage:

But the Wolves' path to championship contention is more likely a 3-6 year process than 2-3 seasons, and the danger is that Thibodeau burns out his roster, physically and mentally, with his competitive zeal and in-your-face style. It would be especially interesting to see how he and Wiggins -- an enigmatic, at least outwardly taciturn personality -- interact. One of Mitchell's virtues this past season was not badgering Wiggins as much as he did LaVine and Towns, in the belief that more private consultation was the way to get through to him.

With most of you jumping on the Thibodeau train, I feel the need to be the voice of reason here. If the hiring of Thibodeau causes Wiggins to lose interest in this situation and look for alternate homes at the end of his rookie deal, this would be a terrible hire. I'm not suggesting it's a likely outcome (Wiggins leaving because of Thibs), but if there is a chance of that happening the whole project could be derailed just like that. We can simply not afford anyone that is going to alienate our star players. We're not LA or NY where you can find replacements relatively easily. We MUST keep this group together if we are going to maximize this run. This is a legitimate concern and it's what scares me about Thibodeau getting the gig.

If this were the case, then I don't think Wiggins is the player people expected....and I would question our teams willingness to offer max dollars to a weak-minded player. This passive attitude crap is why everyone is so entitled today. Oooo, you are mean, and actually have expectations of me.....therefore, I will quit and go play somewhere else where they "appreciate" me more. It's why marriages last less than 50% of the time....people aren't willing to work for the things that matter. In the end, if Wiggins wants out because it is "too hard" with Thibs coaching, then I don't want Andrew on this team. End of rant.

I'm getting really annoyed of agreeing with you, Hicks, but this is spot on.

monsterpile wrote:It's still a players league so some of these things are worth bringing up or having some level of concern about. How much? idk

And even more so moving forward. Players are coming into the league wanting to be business savvy and understand the details of what they are getting into. I think it is foolish to try and apply an antiquated approach based on past results. Lets look ahead. I am almost coming more around to an up and comer as a candidate. Although I do have to say that JVG seems very nuanced in how he considers players, particularly around his patience for player development.

http://www.blogabull.com/2016/4/19/11456450/beat-writers-spilling-the-beans

hmmm doesn't seem like there is much blame to be put on Thibs based on this

thedoper wrote:

monsterpile wrote:It's still a players league so some of these things are worth bringing up or having some level of concern about. How much? idk

And even more so moving forward. Players are coming into the league wanting to be business savvy and understand the details of what they are getting into. I think it is foolish to try and apply an antiquated approach based on past results. Lets look ahead. I am almost coming more around to an up and comer as a candidate. Although I do have to say that JVG seems very nuanced in how he considers players, particularly around his patience for player development.

I have no idea how effective interviews of NBA head coaches are (from what I have read many typical job interviews are poor at selecting the best canidates) but we don't know the outcome of the interviews so far. Maybe nobody has really impressed Glen and KF like they hoped. Maybe their top guys told them we want to you be absolutely sure we are the guys you want. Go talk to everyone you want within reason and get back to us in a few days and you will see I am the best guy etc. Maybe after these interviews Glen said "I'm not absolutely sure about these guys maybe we can still talk to Dave Joeger before making a decision" idk. We don't have a lot of info and we don't know if that info we don't have is worthwhile or not. Lol

BloopOracle wrote:http://www.blogabull.com/2016/4/19/11456450/beat-writers-spilling-the-beans

hmmm doesn't seem like there is much blame to be put on Thibs based on this

The article was more about their current situation, so it would make sense that the current blame shouldn't rest on the coach from a year ago. But I would hope that Thibs could account for leadership rift that began to develop in his locker room. What is clear is that the whole thing was a mess, and there is no doubt that it needs to be accounted for and it is incumbent on Thibs to be able to explain what he would have done differently should a similar mess arrive.