Ayo is back!

[BeenLurkin]

For not winning a championship is why someone or multiple people need to take the fall. That is what winning fanbases and organizations require.

Our standard here is not championships obviously.

….1991…championships haven’t been the standard for 35 years my guy…and looking back past that…87…and then nothing….ever…

Your paradigm is the problem. Maybe you should just buy Knicks merch and pretend you were right all along? If you require a championship you’re already lost.

Why is that? The fanbase doesn't require it. If we stopped buying tickets, quit watching the games, booed at piss poor play, things would need to change. The standard is created by the fans. I blame the MN softass fanbase.

Cool. Scream into the void. Be my guest. But please shut the fuck up about it here. Start your revolution by not posting about it anymore.

[AussieWolf3]

Whos taking the fall for the blunder then? Finch, TC? Who is getting held accountable for screwing this up!!!

I agree with Lip that maybe we could be the 6th seed, maybe win a playoff round.

Give me the plan to how you are going to beat the Spurs and OKC, even the Knicks? How are you going to play on that level?

Hoping that Jaden becomes Kawhi Leonard in his prime isn't a sound strategy.

Yeah we can be a nice team to watch, but a loser in the end.

I agree with Grey that we can’t judge reliably until we see where we’re at when the season starts after the draft, free agency and possible further trades. I get your angst at the moment. I’m disappointed that we’re in this predicament, which ultimately ties back to what I still consider the highly ill-advised trade for Rudy. But it is what it is. Here are my thoughts right now on the concerns you’ve raised.

First, your question about who takes the fall if things don’t work has an easy, obvious answer — namely Tim Connelly. He’s ultimately responsible for all the moves this team has made since he inherited a team that won 46 games with a core of teenagers - Ant, Jaden and Naz - and KAT, along with role players like Beasley, Vando and Pat Bev. I still think TC can salvage things with our core of Ant, Jaden, Naz and Ayo along with the potential of Beringer, Rocco and TSJ and get this team in the vicinity of OKC and San Antonio, but the window is shrinking and he has to make all the right moves going forward.

Second, I can’t give you a specific plan to contend with the Spurs and Thunder, but that’s TC’s job and as I indicated above, I think he’s capable of doing it but we have to hope he’s already exceeded his share of screw-ups and that the law of averages favors him making a string of really savvy moves. I actually think the Randle deal last night was a somewhat savvy move. I’ll add that I don’t think we’re light years away from competing with those two teams or the Knicks. We were the 6th seed and beat the Nuggets in the first round with our best player either out or hurt that series. Beyond that, TC has quite a bit to work with this summer to improve the team next season and thereafter, including free agency with a full MLE and BAE along with a trade exception, the 33rd pick in this year’s draft and a possible strategic Rudy deal.

Third, no one is counting on Jaden becoming Kawhi Leonard. What some of us are talking about are small improvements from multiple players adding up to significant improvement in the team overall. All of our core players are young enough to exhibit at least small if not moderate improvements in the next couple years. Beringer, Rocco and TSJ could easily improve dramatically. There’s the overall team improvement resulting from the Randle deal’s addition-by-subtraction effect. And of course there are additions through free free agency and trades yet to come this summer.

Finally, I’ll add that we may not be able to catch the Spurs or OKC. If that’s the case, then it’s time for a thorough rebuild. But I don’t believe that time is upon us yet.

Your stance is reasonable. I'm still angry that we are not making significant moves needed to potentially put us over the top. Maybe more so that no moves exist. Because your potential growth from Jaden and Naz won't compare to the major leaps coming from the Spurs players who were already in the Finals and age 22 or younger.

Progress isn't linear.
Everyone just keeps assuming everything happens in a vacuum without any interceding variables. We just assume Wemby is gonna get better without acknowledging that there are very real steps that he has to take offensively to get there and it's no guarantee he will.
Castle could platue. Harper could start making waves if his role continues to be diminished.
God forbid, folks get hurt.

Obviously the Wolves need to get better if they're reasonably going to beat them or the Thunder, but this idea that they are destined to outpace the wolves and that they're grown is inevitable to be exponential is simply divorced from reality

[BeenLurkin]

I agree with Grey that we can’t judge reliably until we see where we’re at when the season starts after the draft, free agency and possible further trades. I get your angst at the moment. I’m disappointed that we’re in this predicament, which ultimately ties back to what I still consider the highly ill-advised trade for Rudy. But it is what it is. Here are my thoughts right now on the concerns you’ve raised.

First, your question about who takes the fall if things don’t work has an easy, obvious answer — namely Tim Connelly. He’s ultimately responsible for all the moves this team has made since he inherited a team that won 46 games with a core of teenagers - Ant, Jaden and Naz - and KAT, along with role players like Beasley, Vando and Pat Bev. I still think TC can salvage things with our core of Ant, Jaden, Naz and Ayo along with the potential of Beringer, Rocco and TSJ and get this team in the vicinity of OKC and San Antonio, but the window is shrinking and he has to make all the right moves going forward.

Second, I can’t give you a specific plan to contend with the Spurs and Thunder, but that’s TC’s job and as I indicated above, I think he’s capable of doing it but we have to hope he’s already exceeded his share of screw-ups and that the law of averages favors him making a string of really savvy moves. I actually think the Randle deal last night was a somewhat savvy move. I’ll add that I don’t think we’re light years away from competing with those two teams or the Knicks. We were the 6th seed and beat the Nuggets in the first round with our best player either out or hurt that series. Beyond that, TC has quite a bit to work with this summer to improve the team next season and thereafter, including free agency with a full MLE and BAE along with a trade exception, the 33rd pick in this year’s draft and a possible strategic Rudy deal.

Third, no one is counting on Jaden becoming Kawhi Leonard. What some of us are talking about are small improvements from multiple players adding up to significant improvement in the team overall. All of our core players are young enough to exhibit at least small if not moderate improvements in the next couple years. Beringer, Rocco and TSJ could easily improve dramatically. There’s the overall team improvement resulting from the Randle deal’s addition-by-subtraction effect. And of course there are additions through free free agency and trades yet to come this summer.

Finally, I’ll add that we may not be able to catch the Spurs or OKC. If that’s the case, then it’s time for a thorough rebuild. But I don’t believe that time is upon us yet.

Your stance is reasonable. I'm still angry that we are not making significant moves needed to potentially put us over the top. Maybe more so that no moves exist. Because your potential growth from Jaden and Naz won't compare to the major leaps coming from the Spurs players who were already in the Finals and age 22 or younger.

Progress isn't linear.
Everyone just keeps assuming everything happens in a vacuum without any interceding variables. We just assume Wemby is gonna get better without acknowledging that there are very real steps that he has to take offensively to get there and it's no guarantee he will.
Castle could platue. Harper could start making waves if his role continues to be diminished.
God forbid, folks get hurt.

Obviously the Wolves need to get better if they're reasonably going to beat them or the Thunder, but this idea that they are destined to outpace the wolves and that they're grown is inevitable to be exponential is simply divorced from reality

Exactly. Every year the league resets itself. And every 10 years or so the rules change! I don’t know how many times o can say this but again, 8! Different champs in last 8 years. You can not just make a move because you desire to. This isn’t nba2k. The other team has to agree with you. No one wants to give Ant a “Pippen”. Teams should actively ignore calls from OKC and spurs if they were smart. Let them implode on themselves. The parity of the NBa is something other leagues aspire to. Fortunes can change in a year or two.

[60WinTim]

Randle deserves the blame for TC having to move him. He's the one that decided to "check out" after his name surfaced in a potential trade for Giannis. Randle did nothing to indicate he had any desire to stay here. So, TC was forced to oblige. I think TC has made lemonade out of those lemons. The Wolves are well positioned to become a better team than they have been the past two years.

And I don't buy this team cannot match up with OKC or San Antonio. We have a lot of great pieces. Let TC cook some more and let it roll.

[Q-is-here]

I always like looking at the journey Boston went through starting with the first year Brown and Tatum played together, when Tatum was a rookie and Brown was in his second season:

2017-18: Lost Eastern Conference Finals
2018-19: Lost Eastern Conference Semis
2019-20: Lost Eastern Conference Finals
2020-21: Lost in the First Round
2021-22: Lost in the Finals
2022-23: Lost Eastern Conference Finals
2023-24: Won Finals

Jaylen Brown was 27 and Tatum 26 when they finally won the Finals after first being bounced in six consecutive playoff appearances.

On the one hand, actually making the playoffs and making so many deep runs is really impressive. On the other hand, they had a LOT of bites at the apple that fell short before breaking through. Al Horford was the only other player on the Finals roster that was with the team in 2017-18. So tons of roster churn in that timeframe as well.

[BeenLurkin]

I always like looking at the journey Boston went through starting with the first year Brown and Tatum played together, when Tatum was a rookie and Brown was in his second season:

2017-18: Lost Eastern Conference Finals
2018-19: Lost Eastern Conference Semis
2019-20: Lost Eastern Conference Finals
2020-21: Lost in the First Round
2021-22: Lost in the Finals
2022-23: Lost Eastern Conference Finals
2023-24: Won Finals

Jaylen Brown was 27 and Tatum 26 when they finally won the Finals after first being bounced in six consecutive playoff appearances.

On the one hand, actually making the playoffs and making so many deep runs is really impressive. On the other hand, they had a LOT of bites at the apple that fell short before breaking through. Al Horford was the only other player on the Finals roster that was with the team in 2017-18. So tons of roster churn in that timeframe as well.

What failures. So glad I don’t have to put up with that mediocrity.

[Phenom]

Dane made a good point that Ayo is getting in the 12% (roughly) of the total cap. He is the quality of player that is typically getting 12% of the cap.

[TheGrey08]

I always like looking at the journey Boston went through starting with the first year Brown and Tatum played together, when Tatum was a rookie and Brown was in his second season:

2017-18: Lost Eastern Conference Finals
2018-19: Lost Eastern Conference Semis
2019-20: Lost Eastern Conference Finals
2020-21: Lost in the First Round
2021-22: Lost in the Finals
2022-23: Lost Eastern Conference Finals
2023-24: Won Finals

Jaylen Brown was 27 and Tatum 26 when they finally won the Finals after first being bounced in six consecutive playoff appearances.

On the one hand, actually making the playoffs and making so many deep runs is really impressive. On the other hand, they had a LOT of bites at the apple that fell short before breaking through. Al Horford was the only other player on the Finals roster that was with the team in 2017-18. So tons of roster churn in that timeframe as well.

Great post. Stuff like this adds interesting context. I was curious so I looked up who they faced too. Cavs & Bucks the tougher teams they faced, but I think the Wolves have faced a gauntlet comparatively.

2017-18: Cavaliers
2018-19: Bucks
2019-20: Heat
2020-21: Nets
2022-23: Heat

[TheGrey08]

Dane made a good point that Ayo is getting in the 12% (roughly) of the total cap. He is the quality of player that is typically getting 12% of the cap.

Yeah and if the cap goes up significantly it could end up being a great contract for the Wolves.

[D-Loser25]

….1991…championships haven’t been the standard for 35 years my guy…and looking back past that…87…and then nothing….ever…

Your paradigm is the problem. Maybe you should just buy Knicks merch and pretend you were right all along? If you require a championship you’re already lost.

Why is that? The fanbase doesn't require it. If we stopped buying tickets, quit watching the games, booed at piss poor play, things would need to change. The standard is created by the fans. I blame the MN softass fanbase.

Cool. Scream into the void. Be my guest. But please shut the fuck up about it here. Start your revolution by not posting about it anymore.

lol I just love it when people tell others not to voice their opinion on the chat board. Only positive thoughts here, otherwise take it somewhere else. lol can’t make this stuff up.