Coaching vs. Players.

[AbeVigodaLive]

I've mentioned it before... I was never much of an NBA coach guy. I grew up thinking it was a player's league. Or more accurately, a superstar player league.

But over the years, I've softened my stance a bit on that primarily from visiting this forum and learning a lot of interesting things from you guys. But I'm not all-in just yet. Not even close.

Players win/lose games. The job of coaches is to put them in the best position to do so.

The three starting perimeter guys tonight shot 10 - 37 fg. Add in their backups and they shot 11 - 44 fg. (25%)

Is that Thibs fault? Maybe. But unfortunately, coaches rarely get the credit when guys shoot well. Remember, it's a "make or miss league."

Something is amiss with this team for it to blow so many leads. Could be a bit of coaching. But to pin all the blame there seems too myopic for me. There are stats and other narratives that suggest there are others to blame, too. Remember, this is a super young team playing for the WORST franchise in NBA history (apologies to the Clippers).

Nobody on the roster has won. Anything. And right now, it's revealing itself. As noted in another thread, we're the exact opposite of the Memphis Grizzlies. Is it coaching there too? Maybe. But Joerger did it and he's not doing too much in Sacramento. Is it Fizdale? Maybe.

Personally, I think it's the players. Maybe it's because I grew up in an era when even KC Jones could win 65 games roaming the sidelines.

[AbeVigodaLive]

You guys want a crazy stat?

The Wolves top two PGs have not COMBINED to score more than 15 points in any game this season. They've only reached 12+ points combined twice. I know... I know... "But the team is still (xth) in offensive efficiency."

I get it. But that number is an anomaly in today's NBA. Does it have anything to do with the anomaly of all these blown leads? Is it because the team is relying solely on the likes of three 21 year olds for scoring... none of whom have ever been even remotely successful in the NBA?

[Monster]

Good 2 posts Abe I'm not sure what else I can add.

[kekgeek]

I 100% agree with your post.

We can blame thibs all we want but did he shot 60 some % from the FT line. Did he continually miss wide open 3 after wide open 3. I think people are using thibs as a scapegoat to deflect from the possible main problem that our young guys might not lead us to the promise land and that is scary as shit to think (in no way am I giving up on them).

We are playing with our best 3 players being 22 and 21 with no production out of the pg position (I am turning on ricky). I know what the numbers say about ricky on/off but this is the second era (love/young guys) that we can't hold on to leads and Ricky is the same variable.

Sucks when we have no vet production at all. I know thibs could have some doing with our bad start I would be stupid not to at least acknowledge that but we are running good plays taking good shots. I honestly don't think he is the problem like I thought sam Mitchell was for a lot of last year (long 2 offense, terrible hockey rotations, no creativity out of time outs, his temperament)

[longstrangetrip [enjin:6600564]]

Abe, I'm not saying Thibs is entirely responsible for the dramatic turnaround from the fun and promising final quarter of last season...but I think we're in denial if we don't see him as a huge factor. No, coaches don't miss shots...but if they overwork their players with 40-minute games or at the previous days' practice, the players' tired legs will lead to more missed shots. And will lead to much worse defense in the 4th quarter. And that's on Thibs. We all know the rep he came here with, and hoped that he had learned to dial it back during his year off...our hopes were in vain.

There is one big factor in the past two bad losses that is not on Thibs, and that's the return of the sleepy Wig...god, he was disinterested last night. And since we saw this same inconsistent effort on Wig's part under Sam Mitchell and Flip Saunders, that's clearly a factor that is all about Wig and not about coaching. KAT may be underperforming in some of our eyes, but nobody can claim he doesn't bring it every night...the guy is a bundle of energy out there. But while Wig has been brilliant most of this year, games like the last two make a serious fan just want to pull your hair out.

[BizarroJerry [enjin:6592520]]

Can't play starters 38 minutes each. I'm not blaming thibs on this loss, but we can't maintain those heavy minutes.

[Q12543 [enjin:6621299]]

I think this whole area of why do teams choke or give up leads or whose sum of the parts appear greater than the whole is a total mystery. As Abe likes to remind us, this is the type of stuff that the advanced stats crowd can't explain and it's part of the wonder and mystique of team sports.

I have no clue why this team totally collapses for stretches of time and gives up these huge runs where our offense goes totally cold and our defense disappears. I think a number of folks here have posited what could be valid theories: They're young and don't know how to react to adversity; they are mentally soft; the coach is a micromanager that works them too hard; they don't have a point guard that can get them a big bucket when they need one; one of their best players can't do anything but score, etc., etc.

Let the debate continue, but let's face it, none of us really understands why the hell this team is underachieving right now.

[Porckchop]

When your losing games by 4-6 points and your getting very little scoring from certain positions I will place blame there. The coaching is putting this team in a position to have a chance to win most of these games . NBA games are almost always decided in the 4th quarter alone, and theyve been right there at the end regardless of 3rd quarter woes. 1-7s ,2-6 nights are getting real old when a shot here or there would've made all the difference

[Coolbreeze44]

I hate to say it, but you could almost blame last night's loss exclusively on Wiggins. Like I said in the game thread, I almost hope he was sick or had something else going on. Because that effort was embarrassing and non-professional. The only thing we don't know is if the things we don't see on non-game days are sapping these guys of their energy. All I know is something isn't right.

[AbeVigodaLive]

That's the joy/agony of team sports, right Cool? There are just so many factors that come into play. The thing is that while rooting for the worst franchise in modern NBA history... I'm getting sick of being the negative outlier. Always.

- How many teams in NBA history with somebody as good as Kevin Garnett only makes it out of the 1st round once?
- How many teams get caught with the Joe Smith contract?
- How many teams have the architect of the entire franchise die unexpectedly just as it's about to unfold?
- How many teams have a guy in the Top 5 for Win Shares... that loses 60 games?
- How many teams can be in the top 10 for offensive and defensive efficiency... and be under .500 almost the entire year?
- How many teams have outscored their opponents this season... but have the 2nd fewest wins in the league?