Kyrie trade discussion

[FNG]

I started this discussion on Tim's Ant 2.0 thread, but there seems to be enough buzz surrounding a deal centered around Kyrie and Ju that it deserves its own thread. I'm very much in favor because I still can't see Ant is the centerpiece of a championship team without a very good complementary piece. I want to respond to Tim's comment though that I have capped Ant's ceiling, because I would rephrase that. Instead, I can't see the current version of Ant...that is, a prolific scorer and terrific shooter who doesn't show up well in stats that more accurately reflect overall value...leading a team to a championship without a star next to him. But I am clearly NOT saying Ant can't get to that level...only that he CURRENTLY falls short of the true superstars. And Kyrie paired with Ant is a great start to a championship roster.

Positive aspects:
Kyrie is an elite 2-way player who both would create a true 1A and 1B situation but also allow Ant to play more off ball. Internet rumors suggest he may not want to part of a rebuild led by a teenager, and may ask to be traded to a contender. Because of his age and knee injury, he may not be as costly to acquire as I suggested in the other thread...maybe Ju, a pick, and pieces to match salary. I'm sure TC would try to complete a deal without including Ayo or Donte, but might have to add one of them to complete the deal.

Negative aspects:
Kyrie will be 34 next season and coming off a knee injury, and hasn't exactly been Lou Gehrig during his career. While he seems to have matured as he got into his 30s, he has been a weird dude at times. I don't think anyone here is too concerned about moving on from Ju, but would a draft pick and a rotation wing be too much if that is the cost?

[Q-is-here]

His age is the biggest issue and it gets back to what price we have to pay to get him. You just don't see a player his age be one of the top two players on a title team. The last guy to do it was LeBron during the bubble year and before that it was Tim Duncan when the Spurs won their last title. Michael Jordan won his last title at age 34. Kyrie will be 35 by the time next post-season rolls around.

That doesn't mean he can't be a major part of the core for the next two seasons. But if he has to be Option 1A or B then I just don't see it as sustainable into the playoffs. He'll eventually get hurt or lack burst by the time the playoffs roll around.

That's why it all comes down to price point. If he's as cheap as Kek thinks he might be, I'd be really tempted to go for it, but with the caveat that his minutes and games played are limited in the regular season so that he can be 100% for the post-season. That means we have to keep adding depth to our back court and makes signing Ayo all the more important since he could fill in at either guard position.

[thedoper]

Please no on injury prone vets. Let's look at Ayo and more youth in the position. Even though Dillingham didnt work out I would love to see them wiggle a draft day move to get another guard on the roster.

[Coolbreeze44]

Ant, Giannis, and Jaden are capable of winning a title together. If you can't maintain having those 3, don't go for a Giannis trade. If you can, by all means make it happen. We have some assets, but I'm not sure we have enough.

[Wolvesfan21]

Ant, Giannis, and Jaden are capable of winning a title together. If you can't maintain having those 3, don't go for a Giannis trade. If you can, by all means make it happen. We have some assets, but I'm not sure we have enough.

I think the only way that happens is if Giannis demands to be traded to MN. Then we can get him for some type of three team deal involving Rudy and Ju. But that seems super unlikely to me considering how he doesn't want to burn the Bucks franchise. He can say I'll finish out my contract and you get nothing, or go to MN. I don't see it.

I think if you want Giannis you are giving up Jaden plus either Rudy or Ju type of deal.

[Wolvesfan21]

Please no on injury prone vets. Let's look at Ayo and more youth in the position. Even though Dillingham didnt work out I would love to see them wiggle a draft day move to get another guard on the roster.

I get the risk, but I think we're ready now or never (OKC and SA are not going anywhere). Trying to hit a miraculous draft pick seems to me like a much longer shot. I'd rather risk Kyrie can come back and stay healthy while being 90+% of his old self. I think it's reasonably possible.

I think relying on a draft pick to hit, you might as well wait the three years too while we move East. Can we even keep Ant happy enough for three years of likely getting no where close to beating SA or OKC just so we can avoid them till possibly the Finals?

I bet it all right now on Kyrie.

Otherwise I think you should trade both Ju and Randle and try to get younger, build up possible momentum for 3 years from now.

I think the Wolves have to make a choice now. Rudy is probably more valuable to an Eastern team also. So is Ju. They could certainly help a middling team contend there, while I see doing a middling plan here as selling both short on the now and future.

[thedoper]

Please no on injury prone vets. Let's look at Ayo and more youth in the position. Even though Dillingham didnt work out I would love to see them wiggle a draft day move to get another guard on the roster.

I get the risk, but I think we're ready now or never (OKC and SA are not going anywhere). Trying to hit a miraculous draft pick seems to me like a much longer shot. I'd rather risk Kyrie can come back and stay healthy while being 90+% of his old self. I think it's reasonably possible.

I think relying on a draft pick to hit, you might as well wait the three years too while we move East. Can we even keep Ant happy enough for three years of likely getting no where close to beating SA or OKC just so we can avoid them till possibly the Finals?

I bet it all right now on Kyrie.

Otherwise I think you should trade both Ju and Randle and try to get younger, build up possible momentum for 3 years from now.

I think the Wolves have to make a choice now. Rudy is probably more valuable to an Eastern team also. So is Ju. They could certainly help a middling team contend there, while I see doing a middling plan here as selling both short on the now and future.

I think you hit my perspective. I am ok going the 3 year route and thinking about a new window. I would have preferred it was done last year. Ant could get just as restless and the national narrative will grow with a string of playoff let downs. I think Kyrie is way too risky of a bet to go all in, for a myriad of reasons beyond his injury history and age. It just feels all to familiar of a desperate Minnesota move. Sign Ayo, find another young PG via trade or Draft from my perspective.

[Wolvesfan21]

Please no on injury prone vets. Let's look at Ayo and more youth in the position. Even though Dillingham didnt work out I would love to see them wiggle a draft day move to get another guard on the roster.

I get the risk, but I think we're ready now or never (OKC and SA are not going anywhere). Trying to hit a miraculous draft pick seems to me like a much longer shot. I'd rather risk Kyrie can come back and stay healthy while being 90+% of his old self. I think it's reasonably possible.

I think relying on a draft pick to hit, you might as well wait the three years too while we move East. Can we even keep Ant happy enough for three years of likely getting no where close to beating SA or OKC just so we can avoid them till possibly the Finals?

I bet it all right now on Kyrie.

Otherwise I think you should trade both Ju and Randle and try to get younger, build up possible momentum for 3 years from now.

I think the Wolves have to make a choice now. Rudy is probably more valuable to an Eastern team also. So is Ju. They could certainly help a middling team contend there, while I see doing a middling plan here as selling both short on the now and future.

I think you hit my perspective. I am ok going the 3 year route and thinking about a new window. I would have preferred it was done last year. Ant could get just as restless and the national narrative will grow with a string of playoff let downs. I think Kyrie is way too risky of a bet to go all in, for a myriad of reasons beyond his injury history and age. It just feels all to familiar of a desperate Minnesota move. Sign Ayo, find another young PG via trade or Draft from my perspective.

And trade Ju and Rudy for picks and younger players.

I do think you either go for it now, or retool. I have a bad feeling they will go the middle route and take neither which limits both upsides. Just try and get marginally better (some Ju trade for a mid tier PG) while probably keeping Rudy, maybe even keeping Ju which would be foolish. They haven't fired Finch, so that window looks closed too.

The only scenario in keeping Ju (maybe till the trade deadline) would be if the market is really trash, which I still don't see. He needs a change of scenery and to go East. He'll have more success there and he's a fine player / borderline All Star at times on a fair deal. There is potential for some team to get the best out of him, we unfortunately failed.

[Monster]

While I still don't think it's gonna take a ton to acquire Kyrie if Dallas does want to deal him I think Dallas is gonna have to get something besides a random end of the 1st round pick from the a wolves and some other high priced player back unless they really like that player. The reason why some are advocating to acquire Kyrie is why Dallas may just want to keep him. It's not like that's a bad roster with Flagg and a healthy Kyrie they could be plenty interesting.

[Monster]

I get the risk, but I think we're ready now or never (OKC and SA are not going anywhere). Trying to hit a miraculous draft pick seems to me like a much longer shot. I'd rather risk Kyrie can come back and stay healthy while being 90+% of his old self. I think it's reasonably possible.

I think relying on a draft pick to hit, you might as well wait the three years too while we move East. Can we even keep Ant happy enough for three years of likely getting no where close to beating SA or OKC just so we can avoid them till possibly the Finals?

I bet it all right now on Kyrie.

Otherwise I think you should trade both Ju and Randle and try to get younger, build up possible momentum for 3 years from now.

I think the Wolves have to make a choice now. Rudy is probably more valuable to an Eastern team also. So is Ju. They could certainly help a middling team contend there, while I see doing a middling plan here as selling both short on the now and future.

I think you hit my perspective. I am ok going the 3 year route and thinking about a new window. I would have preferred it was done last year. Ant could get just as restless and the national narrative will grow with a string of playoff let downs. I think Kyrie is way too risky of a bet to go all in, for a myriad of reasons beyond his injury history and age. It just feels all to familiar of a desperate Minnesota move. Sign Ayo, find another young PG via trade or Draft from my perspective.

And trade Ju and Rudy for picks and younger players.

I do think you either go for it now, or retool. I have a bad feeling they will go the middle route and take neither which limits both upsides. Just try and get marginally better (some Ju trade for a mid tier PG) while probably keeping Rudy, maybe even keeping Ju which would be foolish. They haven't fired Finch, so that window looks closed too.

The only scenario in keeping Ju (maybe till the trade deadline) would be if the market is really trash, which I still don't see. He needs a change of scenery and to go East. He'll have more success there and he's a fine player / borderline All Star at times on a fair deal. There is potential for some team to get the best out of him, we unfortunately failed.

Randle had a couple pretty good seasons here. I don't think the Wolves failed in getting the best out him. I think there might be better fits in terms of roster but he was pretty successful here and for that reason there will likely be at least one team that will be interested in adding him to their roster.