Simmons Prediction Thread

[Monster]

Good points, Monster. I agree with you on Doc Rivers as one of the reasons Simmons wants out. Doc publicly threw Simmons under the bus right after the team was eliminated from the playoffs and, as you noted, Doc then mocked Simmons in his appearance on MSNBC. If I bought that team, I'd immediately fire Morey and Doc.

Lip I was suggesting (although admittedly speculating) that Doc's actual coaching is a reason why Simmons wants out.

Hmm. I think you're on to something there. You're probably right that Simmons didn't like playing for Doc. On the flip side, I suspect Doc didn't like coaching him. Hence, Doc's post game comment throwing Simmons under the bus.

I don't take what Brian Windhorst saying too seriously but he did mention that a Simmons didn't like how he was used under Rivers. I believe there was someone else that said something similar but I might be misremembering that. We didn't know how well Simmons takes to coaching. Apparently Luka didn't like Rick Carlisle coaching him...which was interesting after watching that Shannon Sharpe video with ametta a world Peace who had very positive things to say about Carlisle but also said that some guys didn't like to be coached by him but he loved being coached by him. Having said all that not every coach and player are a good fit for each other.

I also remember those reports you're referring to. And I agree that not every coach and player fit well together. That's an often overlooked consideration. The top priority of any NBA organization should be accumulating talent. But it's also a matter of how that talent fits together. Likewise, the second priority should be hiring the best possible head coach. But it's also a matter of how that coach will fit with the team's players, especially the team's top players. The good news for the Wolves is that apparently, KAT, Ant , DLO and Beverley all all on record saying they really like Finch and are in sync with his coaching philosophy. We'll see how that holds up, but so far so good.

Yes like you have laid out here coaching and fit matters. When the Lebron AD Lakers came to be I thought it was interesting that they hired Vogel. I thought he did a good job with that group. Great? Maybe not but I thought he added value and also didn't screw it up. Idk if he will be the right guy for this group. They may need someone that's more of a personality guy. That's not a knock on Vogel. I think Mike D'Antoni is a very good coach just putting him with the wrong group of players even if they are talented isn't going to work. Like you said it looks so far that Finch is the right guy but it's early. Finch seems legitimately likable so that really helps. I also think he and Gupta COULD be fantastic partners to lead this franchise.

[Camden [enjin:6601484]]

Minnesota Timberwolves First 20 Games:

10/20: vs. Houston Rockets
10/23: vs. New Orleans Pelicans (Zion Williamson: Doubtful)
10/25: vs. New Orleans Pelicans (Zion Williamson: Doubtful)
10/27: at Milwaukee Bucks
10/30: vs. Denver Nuggets (Jamal Murray: Out)
11/01: vs. Orlando Magic (Jonathan Isaac, Markelle Fultz: Questionable)
11/03: vs. Los Angeles Clippers (Kawhi Leonard: Out)
11/05: vs. Los Angeles Clippers (Kawhi Leonard: Out)
11/08: at Memphis Grizzlies (Dillon Brooks: Doubtful)
11/10: at Golden State Warriors (Klay Thompson: Out)
11/12: at Los Angeles Lakers
11/13: at Los Angeles Clippers
11/15: vs. Phoenix Suns
11/17: vs. Sacramento Kings
11/18: vs. San Antonio Spurs
11/20: vs. Memphis Grizzlies
11/22: at New Orleans Pelicans
11/24: vs. Miami Heat
11/26: at Charlotte Hornets
11/27: at Philadelphia 76ers

What record through 20 games, if any, would make you think twice about making a trade for Ben Simmons or any other roster-altering piece?

[Monster]

Minnesota Timberwolves First 20 Games:

10/20: vs. Houston Rockets
10/23: vs. New Orleans Pelicans (Zion Williamson: Doubtful)
10/25: vs. New Orleans Pelicans (Zion Williamson: Doubtful)
10/27: at Milwaukee Bucks
10/30: vs. Denver Nuggets (Jamal Murray: Out)
11/01: vs. Orlando Magic (Jonathan Isaac, Markelle Fultz: Questionable)
11/03: vs. Los Angeles Clippers (Kawhi Leonard: Out)
11/05: vs. Los Angeles Clippers (Kawhi Leonard: Out)
11/08: at Memphis Grizzlies (Dillon Brooks: Doubtful)
11/10: at Golden State Warriors (Klay Thompson: Out)
11/12: at Los Angeles Lakers
11/13: at Los Angeles Clippers
11/15: vs. Phoenix Suns
11/17: vs. Sacramento Kings
11/18: vs. San Antonio Spurs
11/20: vs. Memphis Grizzlies
11/22: at New Orleans Pelicans
11/24: vs. Miami Heat
11/26: at Charlotte Hornets
11/27: at Philadelphia 76ers

What record through 20 games, if any, would make you think twice about making a trade for Ben Simmons or any other roster-altering piece?

That's an interesting angle Cam. Really it's not just going to be just about the record but also how the team looks. To be honest anything over .500 if the team actually looks like it's playing well on both sides of the ball would make me think twice about dealing for Simmons. I'm trying to come up with the lowest win total that would really make me think about passing up on a Simmons.l deal 13-7 would sound pretty good. On the flip side I could see the team looking pretty good and still I may wonder about how sustainable it really was and still have interest in making the move for Simmons.

[Wolvesfan21]

15-5 maybe? For me it all depends on what we would have to give up.

If we can just give them Bev and Bease then I jump on it. The compensation I would be willing to give up would go down based on record, but I still would want to make a deal for him.

18-2 I guess I would eliminate any trade options. Which is extremely unlikely.

If the team is floating around .500 then DLO for Simmons swap is my favorite option. Simmons is just going to be a much better player going forward I think even after this fiasco.

[Lipoli390]

The games we absolutely should win assuming we're healthy:

1. 10/20 Rockets (already won)
2. 10/23 Pelicans
3. 11/1 Magic
4. 11/3 or 11/5 Clippers
5. 11/17 Kings
6. 11/18 Spurs
7. 11/20 Grizzlies

I'd call those 7 must-win games for the Wolves. If the Wolves win all 7, but lose the rest, they've be 7-13 20 games into the season. They'd need to win three more to finish at .500. The Wolves have a reasonable chance of picking up those additional three wins in the following games:

1. 11/3 or 11/5 Clippers (I had the Wolves winning only one of these two above)
2. 11/8 at Memphis
3. 11/22 at Pelicans
4. 11/26 at Charlotte
5. 11/13 at Clippers
6.10/30 Denver

If the Wolves win all 7 "must-win" games and three of these six winnable range, they'll be 10-10. I'd say that's enough to feel pretty good about this team going forward. As a young team just learning to play together, the Wolves should get better as the season progresses. When you look at these first 20 games I don't think it's reasonable to expect the Wolves to win more than 13 games. So I'd say 13-7 would be a great achievement. And I don't see a .500 record after the 1st 20 games as reason to panic or scramble to do a deal.

[Wolvesfan21]

Would the Sixers take DLO and a 1st? I do that right now if they do.

I'm looking at this in a 2-4 year term window. If the roster is largely DLO/KAT/Ant/Jaden can we win it all? Yeah that might sound ridiculous since we haven't made the playoffs in several years. But that should be our goal. What is the ceiling of this group? Versus adding in Simmons who is All NBA and instantly makes this team potentially elite on defense and potentially good to great on offense.

How about this starting lineup?

Ant
JO
Jaden
Simmons
Kat

Or

Bev
Ant
Jaden
Simmons
Kat

or

Bolmaro
Ant
Jaden
Simmons
Kat

Yeah I like our current team, but I also think we could be even better.

[Lipoli390]

Would the Sixers take DLO and a 1st? I do that right now if they do.

I'm looking at this in a 2-4 year term window. If the roster is largely DLO/KAT/Ant/Jaden can we win it all? Yeah that might sound ridiculous since we haven't made the playoffs in several years. But that should be our goal. What is the ceiling of this group? Versus adding in Simmons who is All NBA and instantly makes this team potentially elite on defense and potentially good to great on offense.

How about this starting lineup?

Ant
JO
Jaden
Simmons
Kat

Or

Bev
Ant
Jaden
Simmons
Kat

or

Bolmaro
Ant
Jaden
Simmons
Kat

Yeah I like our current team, but I also think we could be even better.

I'd do that deal too if I were Gupta. I'd even throw in two of our three 2022 second-round picks. But I don't see Morey doing that deal. I actually think it would be a good and fair deal for both teams under the circumstances. It seems clear that Morey is going to hold out for a return that no team has yet been willing to give him. He's arrogant and stubborn. As as result, he's self-righteously dug in for the long haul.

Meanwhile, the Wolves are playing well defensively with the current roster. I'd be careful not to gut the offense at this point. I'm fine dealing DLO, but I don't think I'd give up both DLO and Beasley for Simmons. That would take too much from our offense and leave us without any offensive firepower behind KAT and Ant. I also wouldn't give up Beverley who I see as the heart and soul of this team, especially on the defensive end. Yes, Simmons is a terrific defender. But Beverley bring s toughness and attitude that Simmons clearly lacks. And I wouldn't give up McDaniels either. There's too much upside there and he's already a major contributor to the impressive defense we've seen so far. The Wolves only major hole thus far appears to be size/rebounding. I think the Wolves can fill that hole without giving up a lot either via free agency or a relatively minor trade. I'd still like to see the Wolves sign Giles, Cousins or Biyombo.

So yes, I'd deal DLO + our 2022 1st and two of our 2022 2nd round picks for Simmons. And I'd even include Jake Layman in the deal. :) But that's honestly as far as I'd go to get Simmons. And none of that would likely be enough for Morey.

[Camden [enjin:6601484]]

In every one of those starting lineups, especially the one with Anthony Edwards and Josh Okogie starting in the backcourt, I fear that there's not nearly enough perimeter shooting or shot creation. I'm all for acquiring Ben Simmons, but not if it's going to be an unfavorable cast around him after the deal. The fit makes perfect sense to me when you add Simmons to a core of Karl-Anthony Towns, Anthony Edwards, and D'Angelo Russell. You can fill in around those four. For example, you could play Jake Layman or Jaylen Nowell with those four and the unit will be potent on both ends of the floor.

Take away any one of the current three and I'm significantly less intrigued by the move to get Simmons. I know I'm not in the majority, but that's my take on it.

[Wolvesfan21]

Would the Sixers take DLO and a 1st? I do that right now if they do.

I'm looking at this in a 2-4 year term window. If the roster is largely DLO/KAT/Ant/Jaden can we win it all? Yeah that might sound ridiculous since we haven't made the playoffs in several years. But that should be our goal. What is the ceiling of this group? Versus adding in Simmons who is All NBA and instantly makes this team potentially elite on defense and potentially good to great on offense.

How about this starting lineup?

Ant
JO
Jaden
Simmons
Kat

Or

Bev
Ant
Jaden
Simmons
Kat

or

Bolmaro
Ant
Jaden
Simmons
Kat

Yeah I like our current team, but I also think we could be even better.

I'd do that deal too if I were Gupta. I'd even throw in two of our three 2022 second-round picks. But I don't see Morey doing that deal. I actually think it would be a good and fair deal for both teams under the circumstances. It seems clear that Morey is going to hold out for a return that no team has yet been willing to give him. He's arrogant and stubborn. As as result, he's self-righteously dug in for the long haul.

Meanwhile, the Wolves are playing well defensively with the current roster. I'd be careful not to gut the offense at this point. I'm fine dealing DLO, but I don't think I'd give up both DLO and Beasley for Simmons. That would take too much from our offense and leave us without any offensive firepower behind KAT and Ant. I also wouldn't give up Beverley who I see as the heart and soul of this team, especially on the defensive end. Yes, Simmons is a terrific defender. But Beverley bring s toughness and attitude that Simmons clearly lacks. And I wouldn't give up McDaniels either. There's too much upside there and he's already a major contributor to the impressive defense we've seen so far. The Wolves only major hole thus far appears to be size/rebounding. I think the Wolves can fill that hole without giving up a lot either via free agency or a relatively minor trade. I'd still like to see the Wolves sign Giles, Cousins or Biyombo.

So yes, I'd deal DLO + our 2022 1st and two of our 2022 2nd round picks for Simmons. And I'd even include Jake Layman in the deal. :) But that's honestly as far as I'd go to get Simmons. And none of that would likely be enough for Morey.

It looks like he's going to be getting traded for pennies on the dollar, so he just might take that DLO offer in the end. We will see.

We just need DLO to step his game up and not have these awful games like last night. Whoopee do he hit a three late, that doesn't make up for 35% shooting or whatever he was at for the game.

As to Cam, if you want all shooters around Simmons we can do that too.

Just off the wall you could even go

Simmons
Bease
Ant
Prince
KAT

Now you got 4 guys who can shoot great.

Or

Bev
Ant
Simmons
Prince
KAT

[Camden [enjin:6601484]]

Jon Krawczynski:

"I think the Wolves are still interested in Ben Simmons. I do also think the way they have seen and watched their team start to come out of the gate and play very together and have great chemistry and have a very good spirit about them allows them to be more patient."