zigzag22 wrote:You take Lebron over Curry/Thompson every single day and preferable 3 times on the weekend. What he is doing right now is truly ridiculous. He has proven that he can lift mediocre players and single-handedly lead a team to the brink of a title.
Lebron is great no doubt, but who says curry couldn't do what lebron is doing I'd he was asked to do as much . Lebron usage rate is off the charts, scewing, his stats sort of how Westbrook kept getting his triple doubles. That is how the cavs have to play to win, but I hate the narrative that lebron is doing it all by himself, the cavs are a well put together basketball team, individually they might not be awesome but put together they are damn good fit. Can somebody explain to me why Westbrook gets some heat this year for shooting to much while lebron gets praised in the finals for very similar styles of play. I take curry and Thompson going forward, and it is close.
Sorry... I don't see how Curry could conceivably be asked to play PG and PF and direct an entire offense around him from the low post and bull rushes to the rim.
mrhockey89 wrote:Curry didn't really explode in the league though his first couple years in the league. He was slowly taking over from Monta Ellis. Rubio didn't come over for 2 years, and Rubio did burst onto the scene his rookie year in the NBA if you recall. I remember being at Rubio's 1st game in a sold out Target Center against the Western Conference champion full strength OKC Thunder and Rubio being an absolute maestro as he torched the Thunder's defense left and right, only to come up short because of a missed call on a layup at the buzzer where the Thunder got away with a foul at the rim and won by 1. Kobe ended that great rookie season for Ricky.
Just going off memory bank though, didn't Curry come off an injury before he got paid? He's twice the player now he was back then.
I don't see why everyone tries to go out of their way to bash Rubio no this board. He's our best veteran player when he's healthy. His on/off court numbers are very revealing. Is it because he's our one trade asset that holds potentially significant value besides Wiggins or #1? I'd be careful what I wish for.
Do you mean that averaging 17.5 ppg, 6 ast, 4.5 rpg, and 2 spg while shooting 46% (with 1/3 of them being 3's) is not "breaking into the league"? Would anyone take a rookie Curry over what we have in Rubio now? I would.
zigzag22 wrote:You take Lebron over Curry/Thompson every single day and preferable 3 times on the weekend. What he is doing right now is truly ridiculous. He has proven that he can lift mediocre players and single-handedly lead a team to the brink of a title.
Lebron is great no doubt, but who says curry couldn't do what lebron is doing I'd he was asked to do as much . Lebron usage rate is off the charts, scewing, his stats sort of how Westbrook kept getting his triple doubles. That is how the cavs have to play to win, but I hate the narrative that lebron is doing it all by himself, the cavs are a well put together basketball team, individually they might not be awesome but put together they are damn good fit. Can somebody explain to me why Westbrook gets some heat this year for shooting to much while lebron gets praised in the finals for very similar styles of play. I take curry and Thompson going forward, and it is close.
Sorry... I don't see how Curry could conceivably be asked to play PG and PF and direct an entire offense around him from the low post and bull rushes to the rim.
Curry's just not the same type of player as Lebron. But you don't think he could carry this Cavs team to a single finals win? One of the greatest shooters of all time getting a 45% usage rate. He could go for 60 in a playoff game with that kind of usage rate. And while he's not making as many plays for his teammates he's still getting a decent chunk of assists per game and getting then involved. Their playing style is different, but Curry could win the game just in a different way from Lebron.
zigzag22 wrote:You take Lebron over Curry/Thompson every single day and preferable 3 times on the weekend. What he is doing right now is truly ridiculous. He has proven that he can lift mediocre players and single-handedly lead a team to the brink of a title.
Lebron is great no doubt, but who says curry couldn't do what lebron is doing I'd he was asked to do as much . Lebron usage rate is off the charts, scewing, his stats sort of how Westbrook kept getting his triple doubles. That is how the cavs have to play to win, but I hate the narrative that lebron is doing it all by himself, the cavs are a well put together basketball team, individually they might not be awesome but put together they are damn good fit. Can somebody explain to me why Westbrook gets some heat this year for shooting to much while lebron gets praised in the finals for very similar styles of play. I take curry and Thompson going forward, and it is close.
Sorry... I don't see how Curry could conceivably be asked to play PG and PF and direct an entire offense around him from the low post and bull rushes to the rim.
Curry's just not the same type of player as Lebron. But you don't think he could carry this Cavs team to a single finals win? One of the greatest shooters of all time getting a 45% usage rate. He could go for 60 in a playoff game with that kind of usage rate. And while he's not making as many plays for his teammates he's still getting a decent chunk of assists per game and getting then involved. Their playing style is different, but Curry could win the game just in a different way from Lebron.
Maybe. But I don't think it's as likely.
I don't know if I can recall a tour de force like James in a very long time... if ever. I know Shaq had moments where he bent an entire defense that was incapable of stopping him.
And Jordan, of course, he's the all-time best for a reason. But the Cavs are basically asking James to be EVERYTHING on offense for his team... and he's doing it.
I don't know if I've seen a player balance being selfish/unselfish on the court as well as James is right now. It's not always been that easy with him (see the 2011 Finals). Game 2 was amazing.
zigzag22 wrote:You take Lebron over Curry/Thompson every single day and preferable 3 times on the weekend. What he is doing right now is truly ridiculous. He has proven that he can lift mediocre players and single-handedly lead a team to the brink of a title.
Lebron is great no doubt, but who says curry couldn't do what lebron is doing I'd he was asked to do as much . Lebron usage rate is off the charts, scewing, his stats sort of how Westbrook kept getting his triple doubles. That is how the cavs have to play to win, but I hate the narrative that lebron is doing it all by himself, the cavs are a well put together basketball team, individually they might not be awesome but put together they are damn good fit. Can somebody explain to me why Westbrook gets some heat this year for shooting to much while lebron gets praised in the finals for very similar styles of play. I take curry and Thompson going forward, and it is close.
Sorry... I don't see how Curry could conceivably be asked to play PG and PF and direct an entire offense around him from the low post and bull rushes to the rim.
Curry's just not the same type of player as Lebron. But you don't think he could carry this Cavs team to a single finals win? One of the greatest shooters of all time getting a 45% usage rate. He could go for 60 in a playoff game with that kind of usage rate. And while he's not making as many plays for his teammates he's still getting a decent chunk of assists per game and getting then involved. Their playing style is different, but Curry could win the game just in a different way from Lebron.
Maybe. But I don't think it's as likely.
I don't know if I can recall a tour de force like James in a very long time... if ever. I know Shaq had moments where he bent an entire defense that was incapable of stopping him.
And Jordan, of course, he's the all-time best for a reason. But the Cavs are basically asking James to be EVERYTHING on offense for his team... and he's doing it.
I don't know if I've seen a player balance being selfish/unselfish on the court as well as James is right now. It's not always been that easy with him (see the 2011 Finals). Game 2 was amazing.
Personally, I hope I don't see it again.
Magic, Bird, and Jordan are the only ones I can think of (since the early 80s - I didn't watch ball before then) that could do so many different things on the basketball court, although I'm not sure Bird and Magic could defend as well as either LeBron or Jordan could.
They all have that rare combination of size, handles, floor vision, and scoring instincts. The problem with Curry is he's missing the size piece. He'll never be able to just bully his way into the paint and take rebounds from people. All those other guys could crash the glass if they had to. And LeBron and Jordan especially could lock down people when they were focused.
zigzag22 wrote:You take Lebron over Curry/Thompson every single day and preferable 3 times on the weekend. What he is doing right now is truly ridiculous. He has proven that he can lift mediocre players and single-handedly lead a team to the brink of a title.
Maybe. But I don't think it's as likely.
I don't know if I can recall a tour de force like James in a very long time... if ever. I know Shaq had moments where he bent an entire defense that was incapable of stopping him.
And Jordan, of course, he's the all-time best for a reason. But the Cavs are basically asking James to be EVERYTHING on offense for his team... and he's doing it.
I don't know if I've seen a player balance being selfish/unselfish on the court as well as James is right now. It's not always been that easy with him (see the 2011 Finals). Game 2 was amazing.
Personally, I hope I don't see it again.
Magic, Bird, and Jordan are the only ones I can think of (since the early 80s - I didn't watch ball before then) that could do so many different things on the basketball court, although I'm not sure Bird and Magic could defend as well as either LeBron or Jordan could.
They all have that rare combination of size, handles, floor vision, and scoring instincts. The problem with Curry is he's missing the size piece. He'll never be able to just bully his way into the paint and take rebounds from people. All those other guys could crash the glass if they had to. And LeBron and Jordan especially could lock down people when they were focused.
I grew up with Magic and Bird. I was a very big Basketball Jesus fan.
But I try to remain objective with my basketball takes. And I hate to admit that James is on his way to passing Bird on my all-time list.
mrhockey89 wrote:I don't think the playoffs tells us anything to be true when it comes to point guards. I heard someone say that on TV the other day and I immediately started thinking about examples suggesting otherwise such as Tony Allen. The Cavs won game 2 after their scoring PG went on the IR in game 1. In fact, I'd argue that Ricky is better than half of the PGs that were in the conference finals games. (WCF+ECF).
Maestro is another way of saying conductor...someone who can run the offense the way it's supposed to be run. You might be able to get stats out of another PG, but that doesn't mean you'll get impact. You get impact with Rubio. He does a lot of things that don't show up in the stat sheet, and I can elaborate if you're not able to see it.
When people trash Rubio, it's for 1 thing. Shooting. On the flip side, I can name several things that he does at a premier level. And ultimately, it should always come down to how well is your team with a guy on the court vs how they are without them on the court. So you go ahead and take your 12 ppg 5 ast replacement that costs us team efficiency, and I'll a PG who takes under 10 shots a game while making the players who are paid to score better.
And ur dismissING the amount of time he misses on the court. He's missed as much time as Pek . Should that just be dismissed? Shooting is not his only weakness. Actually playing is.
Pork, You have been consistent with your criticism of Rubio. If you are going to hang your hat on anything, it should be the injuries, because when Rubio has been healthy, we are simply a different team. Go do your own research on how the team performs when he's in the game versus out of the game and then come back and tell us how he is a liability out there. You won't be able to do it with a straight face....
But yeah....the injuries. I hang my hat on the fact they were one-time incidents that affected different body parts as opposed to chronic issues.
zigzag22 wrote:You take Lebron over Curry/Thompson every single day and preferable 3 times on the weekend. What he is doing right now is truly ridiculous. He has proven that he can lift mediocre players and single-handedly lead a team to the brink of a title.
Maybe. But I don't think it's as likely.
I don't know if I can recall a tour de force like James in a very long time... if ever. I know Shaq had moments where he bent an entire defense that was incapable of stopping him.
And Jordan, of course, he's the all-time best for a reason. But the Cavs are basically asking James to be EVERYTHING on offense for his team... and he's doing it.
I don't know if I've seen a player balance being selfish/unselfish on the court as well as James is right now. It's not always been that easy with him (see the 2011 Finals). Game 2 was amazing.
Personally, I hope I don't see it again.
Magic, Bird, and Jordan are the only ones I can think of (since the early 80s - I didn't watch ball before then) that could do so many different things on the basketball court, although I'm not sure Bird and Magic could defend as well as either LeBron or Jordan could.
They all have that rare combination of size, handles, floor vision, and scoring instincts. The problem with Curry is he's missing the size piece. He'll never be able to just bully his way into the paint and take rebounds from people. All those other guys could crash the glass if they had to. And LeBron and Jordan especially could lock down people when they were focused.
I grew up with Magic and Bird. I was a very big Basketball Jesus fan.
But I try to remain objective with my basketball takes. And I hate to admit that James is on his way to passing Bird on my all-time list.
Dammit.
Yeah, Bird is my all-time favorite player too. I just love watching guys without elite athleticism use smarts, craftiness, touch, and hard work to excel. He definitely embodied that. And actually Magic did too to a large degree. He was not nearly the athlete of a Jordan or LeBron.
One thing that's fun to go look back on with Bird (thanks to YouTube) is the sheer number of really tough game winners he made. I'm sure he missed his fair share too, but my goodness, he made a TON of in-your-face game winners.
Over the years, many folks have talked about "the next Larry Bird", but no one has ever been able to replicate his combination of basketball skills and grittiness. He shortened his career because of how hard he played.
zigzag22 wrote:You take Lebron over Curry/Thompson every single day and preferable 3 times on the weekend. What he is doing right now is truly ridiculous. He has proven that he can lift mediocre players and single-handedly lead a team to the brink of a title.
Lebron is great no doubt, but who says curry couldn't do what lebron is doing I'd he was asked to do as much . Lebron usage rate is off the charts, scewing, his stats sort of how Westbrook kept getting his triple doubles. That is how the cavs have to play to win, but I hate the narrative that lebron is doing it all by himself, the cavs are a well put together basketball team, individually they might not be awesome but put together they are damn good fit. Can somebody explain to me why Westbrook gets some heat this year for shooting to much while lebron gets praised in the finals for very similar styles of play. I take curry and Thompson going forward, and it is close.
Sorry... I don't see how Curry could conceivably be asked to play PG and PF and direct an entire offense around him from the low post and bull rushes to the rim.
Curry's just not the same type of player as Lebron. But you don't think he could carry this Cavs team to a single finals win? One of the greatest shooters of all time getting a 45% usage rate. He could go for 60 in a playoff game with that kind of usage rate. And while he's not making as many plays for his teammates he's still getting a decent chunk of assists per game and getting then involved. Their playing style is different, but Curry could win the game just in a different way from Lebron.
zigzag22 wrote:You take Lebron over Curry/Thompson every single day and preferable 3 times on the weekend. What he is doing right now is truly ridiculous. He has proven that he can lift mediocre players and single-handedly lead a team to the brink of a title.
Maybe. But I don't think it's as likely.
I don't know if I can recall a tour de force like James in a very long time... if ever. I know Shaq had moments where he bent an entire defense that was incapable of stopping him.
And Jordan, of course, he's the all-time best for a reason. But the Cavs are basically asking James to be EVERYTHING on offense for his team... and he's doing it.
I don't know if I've seen a player balance being selfish/unselfish on the court as well as James is right now. It's not always been that easy with him (see the 2011 Finals). Game 2 was amazing.
Personally, I hope I don't see it again.
Magic, Bird, and Jordan are the only ones I can think of (since the early 80s - I didn't watch ball before then) that could do so many different things on the basketball court, although I'm not sure Bird and Magic could defend as well as either LeBron or Jordan could.
They all have that rare combination of size, handles, floor vision, and scoring instincts. The problem with Curry is he's missing the size piece. He'll never be able to just bully his way into the paint and take rebounds from people. All those other guys could crash the glass if they had to. And LeBron and Jordan especially could lock down people when they were focused.
I grew up with Magic and Bird. I was a very big Basketball Jesus fan.
But I try to remain objective with my basketball takes. And I hate to admit that James is on his way to passing Bird on my all-time list.
Dammit.
Yeah, Bird is my all-time favorite player too. I just love watching guys without elite athleticism use smarts, craftiness, touch, and hard work to excel. He definitely embodied that. And actually Magic did too to a large degree. He was not nearly the athlete of a Jordan or LeBron.
One thing that's fun to go look back on with Bird (thanks to YouTube) is the sheer number of really tough game winners he made. I'm sure he missed his fair share too, but my goodness, he made a TON of in-your-face game winners.
Over the years, many folks have talked about "the next Larry Bird", but no one has ever been able to replicate his combination of basketball skills and grittiness. He shortened his career because of how hard he played.
I'm not saying that the new NBA is better with its reliance on the three pointer. But can you imagine how lethal Bird would be as a Stretch 4 in today's game?
There are a lot of "what ifs" with Bird's career. Maybe I'm aware of them more because of how much I followed him and the Celtics as a kid... but he was a bit of a man ahead of his time with his shooting. He wasted several years not even really shooting the three pointer before teams started to realize it could be a valuable weapon.
