Might as well talk draft....

[Monster]

I agree with those saying the Wolves need a defensive big that can protect the rim (and rebound) next to Towns to win. If we can get a Gobert/Jordan/Capela/Adams in the draft with our 2nd or 3rd pick, by all means. Last time we tried, we ended up with Dieng over Gobert, so that makes me nervous. Not like Dieng was terrible, but getting another Dieng won't do anything for this team.

I'm not suggesting it would have worked or been a pairing that would have been on a contending or top 5 west team but just like some other Wolves big man pairings we never really got to see how Towns and Dieng played together for very long. Love and Al Jefferson, Love and Pekovic. How many games did those guys actually start together? Maybe a guy like Dieng especially paid appropriately on his 2nd contract would have helped move this team towards being competitive at least. Again I'm not suggesting Dieng would have been or was an answer but maybe his value could have been greater if circumstances were different. Not to mention his contract would have people view him so much differently. This is so much of the Wolves history we haven't had a chan
ce to see many duo's (Or other possibly talented groups) actually play it out for more than a couple years out and see if they were actually good together. Wiggins and Towns played 4 years together but there was a lot happening during that time. I wonder how many other Wolves teammates In franchise history have played more games together (And or starts) than Towns and Wiggins. Guys just haven't stayed around together or stayed healthy etc etc.

I think there is more than 1 possible path to Become a good team. A defensive big next to Towns? Sure I'd try it. It's not a guarantee that is going to work or the guy we select with whatever pick is going to work out in that regard. It seems like there have been lots of big man flop bigs too. I also think it's possible Towns gets better as a defender and the Wolves find the right guy next to him that's still more of a PF than a center. None of these options are exactly easy to accomplish. Some people believe Wiseman is a good bet to at least be a Capela type. If so and you think a defensive center next to Towns is the path you would take then you want to select him. Cool makes perfect sense especially if you believe in Wiseman being an all-NBA type player. If you are someone that doesn't really believe in Wiseman especially compared to some other options as a defensive center you could pick later...then maybe you go with another type of pick etc etc. obviously we are assuming that this franchise is not going to select a guy that can't be shooting 3's stretching the floor etc...well with a pick that high anyway. I could see them pick a defensive project that can't really shoot with a later pick just because it's a heck of a value and they see the defensive potential etc.

Personally I'm not absolutely tied to any particular route I just think we gotta pick the best player possible because we need talent and this roster has openings and players that do have versatility. Honestly the biggest hole on this roster might be a True Catarina caliber SF sized wing that can defend and hit 3's. Those guys are super valuable even if they are just solid starters...and usually for a team as bad as the Wolves were you would look to aim higher than that with your top pick. I'm keeping my expectations low for this draft...but I don't think I'm ready to just pick a guy like that though.

Ultimately everyone weighing in here has their Ideas of how to maximize the value of the first selection (and compared to having other picks later) and it's based on views of prospects how to build the team etc etc. you know what that mirrors? Other NBA teams and also different basketball folks in hopefully every organization to some extent. I hope the Wolves have some people hanging around that don't all just think the same way. People can buy into a general philosophy but still have some different ways of thinking. I tend to think if the Wolves REALLY thought Wiseman was going to be the next Gobert with a little more offensive ability (Just hypothetically) they would take him and figure it all out. Maybe not. I still say a healthy Pekovic would have been an absolute monster on a team that got up and down the floor. Could you imagine what he would do with 4 other shooters around him? Defense? He and Towns could at least control the boards which has been a pretty big problem since Pek and Love were roaming the paint which seems like a long time ago...2014!?!

[khans2k5 [enjin:6608728]]

I agree with those saying the Wolves need a defensive big that can protect the rim (and rebound) next to Towns to win. If we can get a Gobert/Jordan/Capela/Adams in the draft with our 2nd or 3rd pick, by all means. Last time we tried, we ended up with Dieng over Gobert, so that makes me nervous. Not like Dieng was terrible, but getting another Dieng won't do anything for this team.

I'm not suggesting it would have worked or been a pairing that would have been on a contending or top 5 west team but just like some other Wolves big man pairings we never really got to see how Towns and Dieng played together for very long. Love and Al Jefferson, Love and Pekovic. How many games did those guys actually start together? Maybe a guy like Dieng especially paid appropriately on his 2nd contract would have helped move this team towards being competitive at least. Again I'm not suggesting Dieng would have been or was an answer but maybe his value could have been greater if circumstances were different. Not to mention his contract would have people view him so much differently. This is so much of the Wolves history we haven't had a chan
ce to see many duo's (Or other possibly talented groups) actually play it out for more than a couple years out and see if they were actually good together. Wiggins and Towns played 4 years together but there was a lot happening during that time. I wonder how many other Wolves teammates In franchise history have played more games together (And or starts) than Towns and Wiggins. Guys just haven't stayed around together or stayed healthy etc etc.

I think there is more than 1 possible path to Become a good team. A defensive big next to Towns? Sure I'd try it. It's not a guarantee that is going to work or the guy we select with whatever pick is going to work out in that regard. It seems like there have been lots of big man flop bigs too. I also think it's possible Towns gets better as a defender and the Wolves find the right guy next to him that's still more of a PF than a center. None of these options are exactly easy to accomplish. Some people believe Wiseman is a good bet to at least be a Capela type. If so and you think a defensive center next to Towns is the path you would take then you want to select him. Cool makes perfect sense especially if you believe in Wiseman being an all-NBA type player. If you are someone that doesn't really believe in Wiseman especially compared to some other options as a defensive center you could pick later...then maybe you go with another type of pick etc etc. obviously we are assuming that this franchise is not going to select a guy that can't be shooting 3's stretching the floor etc...well with a pick that high anyway. I could see them pick a defensive project that can't really shoot with a later pick just because it's a heck of a value and they see the defensive potential etc.

Personally I'm not absolutely tied to any particular route I just think we gotta pick the best player possible because we need talent and this roster has openings and players that do have versatility. Honestly the biggest hole on this roster might be a True Catarina caliber SF sized wing that can defend and hit 3's. Those guys are super valuable even if they are just solid starters...and usually for a team as bad as the Wolves were you would look to aim higher than that with your top pick. I'm keeping my expectations low for this draft...but I don't think I'm ready to just pick a guy like that though.

Ultimately everyone weighing in here has their Ideas of how to maximize the value of the first selection (and compared to having other picks later) and it's based on views of prospects how to build the team etc etc. you know what that mirrors? Other NBA teams and also different basketball folks in hopefully every organization to some extent. I hope the Wolves have some people hanging around that don't all just think the same way. People can buy into a general philosophy but still have some different ways of thinking. I tend to think if the Wolves REALLY thought Wiseman was going to be the next Gobert with a little more offensive ability (Just hypothetically) they would take him and figure it all out. Maybe not. I still say a healthy Pekovic would have been an absolute monster on a team that got up and down the floor. Could you imagine what he would do with 4 other shooters around him? Defense? He and Towns could at least control the boards which has been a pretty big problem since Pek and Love were roaming the paint which seems like a long time ago...2014!?!

Towns and Dieng did play together (just not this past season) and they were one of the worst defensive pairings in the league.

[Monster]

I agree with those saying the Wolves need a defensive big that can protect the rim (and rebound) next to Towns to win. If we can get a Gobert/Jordan/Capela/Adams in the draft with our 2nd or 3rd pick, by all means. Last time we tried, we ended up with Dieng over Gobert, so that makes me nervous. Not like Dieng was terrible, but getting another Dieng won't do anything for this team.

I'm not suggesting it would have worked or been a pairing that would have been on a contending or top 5 west team but just like some other Wolves big man pairings we never really got to see how Towns and Dieng played together for very long. Love and Al Jefferson, Love and Pekovic. How many games did those guys actually start together? Maybe a guy like Dieng especially paid appropriately on his 2nd contract would have helped move this team towards being competitive at least. Again I'm not suggesting Dieng would have been or was an answer but maybe his value could have been greater if circumstances were different. Not to mention his contract would have people view him so much differently. This is so much of the Wolves history we haven't had a chan
ce to see many duo's (Or other possibly talented groups) actually play it out for more than a couple years out and see if they were actually good together. Wiggins and Towns played 4 years together but there was a lot happening during that time. I wonder how many other Wolves teammates In franchise history have played more games together (And or starts) than Towns and Wiggins. Guys just haven't stayed around together or stayed healthy etc etc.

I think there is more than 1 possible path to Become a good team. A defensive big next to Towns? Sure I'd try it. It's not a guarantee that is going to work or the guy we select with whatever pick is going to work out in that regard. It seems like there have been lots of big man flop bigs too. I also think it's possible Towns gets better as a defender and the Wolves find the right guy next to him that's still more of a PF than a center. None of these options are exactly easy to accomplish. Some people believe Wiseman is a good bet to at least be a Capela type. If so and you think a defensive center next to Towns is the path you would take then you want to select him. Cool makes perfect sense especially if you believe in Wiseman being an all-NBA type player. If you are someone that doesn't really believe in Wiseman especially compared to some other options as a defensive center you could pick later...then maybe you go with another type of pick etc etc. obviously we are assuming that this franchise is not going to select a guy that can't be shooting 3's stretching the floor etc...well with a pick that high anyway. I could see them pick a defensive project that can't really shoot with a later pick just because it's a heck of a value and they see the defensive potential etc.

Personally I'm not absolutely tied to any particular route I just think we gotta pick the best player possible because we need talent and this roster has openings and players that do have versatility. Honestly the biggest hole on this roster might be a True Catarina caliber SF sized wing that can defend and hit 3's. Those guys are super valuable even if they are just solid starters...and usually for a team as bad as the Wolves were you would look to aim higher than that with your top pick. I'm keeping my expectations low for this draft...but I don't think I'm ready to just pick a guy like that though.

Ultimately everyone weighing in here has their Ideas of how to maximize the value of the first selection (and compared to having other picks later) and it's based on views of prospects how to build the team etc etc. you know what that mirrors? Other NBA teams and also different basketball folks in hopefully every organization to some extent. I hope the Wolves have some people hanging around that don't all just think the same way. People can buy into a general philosophy but still have some different ways of thinking. I tend to think if the Wolves REALLY thought Wiseman was going to be the next Gobert with a little more offensive ability (Just hypothetically) they would take him and figure it all out. Maybe not. I still say a healthy Pekovic would have been an absolute monster on a team that got up and down the floor. Could you imagine what he would do with 4 other shooters around him? Defense? He and Towns could at least control the boards which has been a pretty big problem since Pek and Love were roaming the paint which seems like a long time ago...2014!?!

Towns and Dieng did play together (just not this past season) and they were one of the worst defensive pairings in the league.

That was the year Dieng had those magical DRPM stats but I did I did somehow misread his career stats so basically he and Towns started nearly a season and a half together which was probably enough to make a decision on. Still my point stands that Dieng could have had more value if he had been utilized more. Looking back Taj's DRPM stats that same year I believe they were some of the best at his position. As much as I like Taj and have for years...he wasn't really an answer on D either.

Also looking back at my post... " True Catarina caliber SF sized wing" I have no idea what I was trying to say here but now I KNOW what this team needs...a True Catarina SF wing. Thanks Autocorrect! I'm emailing Rosas right now with my findings!

[Lipoli390]

Wiseman would be my number 1 target. I agree with all those who said that we need a rim protecting big next to KAT. KAT is so good offensively that he can play with anybody and any style of play.

Forget the 1 big lineup. KAT-Wiseman frontcourt gives us an advantage over most frontcourt. With DLO, Beasley(resign) and KAT, we got 3 top tier volume 3 pt shooters to spread the floor. All 3 are below average defender so you need Wiseman there and 1 of culver/okogie with them in the starting lineup and we have a well balance team.

KAT is going to be a matchup problem for most teams at the 4. We got 3 scorers/shooters and a athletic and mobile rim protector(wiseman) and a above average wing defender (culver/okogie) in the starting lineup. Roles and pecking order are clearly defined in that theoretical starting lineup. The best teams have players that play their roles perfectly. KAT is the man on offense. DLO is the 2nd in command and Beasley is the sharpshooter/ energy 3rd guy. Wiseman protects the rim on defense and rim run on offense. Culver/okogie defends the best perimeter guy and contribute on offense with movement off the ball, improve 3pt shooting, opportunistic drive and playmaking.

I agree, World.

[Lipoli390]

I agree with those saying the Wolves need a defensive big that can protect the rim (and rebound) next to Towns to win. If we can get a Gobert/Jordan/Capela/Adams in the draft with our 2nd or 3rd pick, by all means. Last time we tried, we ended up with Dieng over Gobert, so that makes me nervous. Not like Dieng was terrible, but getting another Dieng won't do anything for this team.

Taking Dieng over Gobert wasn't the glaring mistake that year. The glaring and totally unacceptable mistake was selling for cash the 1st round pick the Wolves could have used to take Gobert.

We just have to hope the Rosas regime is a better, smarter front office than all their predecessors throughout the sad history of poor Wolves front offices. So far, I'm not sold on this regime. I think the Rosas regime performed poorly in last year's draft, trading up for Culver and taking a player in the 2nd round who rarely played. The trade for Allan Crabbe was nonsensical. And I'm not thrilled with the Russell deal either.

But he did pick up some promising undrafted free agents. I thought the Beasley trace was terrific. And even the Russell trade doesn't strike me as a terrible deal; just one I disagree with.

This draft will be a huge test for Rosas. I'm
hoping he hits a home run. I don't see him whiffing like Flip when he sold a first round pick for cash.

[mrhockey89]

I agree with those saying the Wolves need a defensive big that can protect the rim (and rebound) next to Towns to win. If we can get a Gobert/Jordan/Capela/Adams in the draft with our 2nd or 3rd pick, by all means. Last time we tried, we ended up with Dieng over Gobert, so that makes me nervous. Not like Dieng was terrible, but getting another Dieng won't do anything for this team.

Taking Dieng over Gobert wasn't the glaring mistake that year. The glaring and totally unacceptable mistake was selling for cash the 1st round pick the Wolves could have used to take Gobert.

We just have to hope the Rosas regime is a better, smarter front office than all their predecessors throughout the sad history of poor Wolves front offices. So far, I'm not sold on this regime. I think the Rosas regime performed poorly in last year's draft, trading up for Culver and taking a player in the 2nd round who rarely played. The trade for Allan Crabbe was nonsensical. And I'm not thrilled with the Russell deal either.

But he did pick up some promising undrafted free agents. I thought the Beasley trace was terrific. And even the Russell trade doesn't strike me as a terrible deal; just one I disagree with.

This draft will be a huge test for Rosas. I'm
hoping he hits a home run. I don't see him whiffing like Flip when he sold a first round pick for cash.

Agreed Lip. Of course, had Flip just grabbed Giannis and Gobert, we'd be talking about how this shortened format will be affecting our home court advantage in the playoffs. I remember when the Wolves traded back just praying they wouldn't take Shabazz, who was what we thought he was.

And I know you're not a big fan of Russell, but I think at the very least you'd have to agree he probably is a better trade chip than Wiggins at this point. Wiggins flashes came in short stints, Russell has been an All-Star, and just as importantly for the Wolves, is a good friend to our best player (helps with good will on trying to get him to buy-in long term). From Rosas' perspective, I believe the Russell move had as much to do with Russell being one of very few young players with All-Star ability upside and the potential to be a cornerstone player that was getable. He's also basically our version of Harden, a ball dominant guard who can and will shoot 3's and can pass. He isn't a good defender, but Harden's big knock when he was in his younger days was his lackluster defense as well. Will he ever be as good as Harden? Probably not, but what's our alternative that gives us any potential to become a contender?

[Lipoli390]

I agree with those saying the Wolves need a defensive big that can protect the rim (and rebound) next to Towns to win. If we can get a Gobert/Jordan/Capela/Adams in the draft with our 2nd or 3rd pick, by all means. Last time we tried, we ended up with Dieng over Gobert, so that makes me nervous. Not like Dieng was terrible, but getting another Dieng won't do anything for this team.

Taking Dieng over Gobert wasn't the glaring mistake that year. The glaring and totally unacceptable mistake was selling for cash the 1st round pick the Wolves could have used to take Gobert.

We just have to hope the Rosas regime is a better, smarter front office than all their predecessors throughout the sad history of poor Wolves front offices. So far, I'm not sold on this regime. I think the Rosas regime performed poorly in last year's draft, trading up for Culver and taking a player in the 2nd round who rarely played. The trade for Allan Crabbe was nonsensical. And I'm not thrilled with the Russell deal either.

But he did pick up some promising undrafted free agents. I thought the Beasley trace was terrific. And even the Russell trade doesn't strike me as a terrible deal; just one I disagree with.

This draft will be a huge test for Rosas. I'm
hoping he hits a home run. I don't see him whiffing like Flip when he sold a first round pick for cash.

Agreed Lip. Of course, had Flip just grabbed Giannis and Gobert, we'd be talking about how this shortened format will be affecting our home court advantage in the playoffs. I remember when the Wolves traded back just praying they wouldn't take Shabazz, who was what we thought he was.

And I know you're not a big fan of Russell, but I think at the very least you'd have to agree he probably is a better trade chip than Wiggins at this point. Wiggins flashes came in short stints, Russell has been an All-Star, and just as importantly for the Wolves, is a good friend to our best player (helps with good will on trying to get him to buy-in long term). From Rosas' perspective, I believe the Russell move had as much to do with Russell being one of very few young players with All-Star ability upside and the potential to be a cornerstone player that was getable. He's also basically our version of Harden, a ball dominant guard who can and will shoot 3's and can pass. He isn't a good defender, but Harden's big knock when he was in his younger days was his lackluster defense as well. Will he ever be as good as Harden? Probably not, but what's our alternative that gives us any potential to become a contender?

Hockey - I agree with your take on the Russell deal.

[kekgeek]

I'm still not sold on Wiseman or drafting any big man. The thing is adding a theoretical defensive big next to Kat is really going to solve this. Why wouldn't teams just run 1-4 pick and roll/pop all day against Kat. I just don't think that changes just because we switch his position. Also teams like the Clippers who play PG at the 4, they'll just iso Kat to death.

Here is my thing also and why I say if we draft a big high he has you be All NBA talent and not Clint Capela talent is the wolves still won't reap the benefits of playing two bigs together. Pretend Wiseman becomes Capela. Teams can still put their big on Kat and Kat will still get his but now the opposition smaller 4 can guard the Capela type player. Is it really in the wolves best interest to take the ball out of Dlo and Kats hands to try and attack the Capela vs small ball 4 matchup. Also off ball defenders can massively cheat the Dlo and Kat PnR because Wiseman a non shooter, okogie a non shooter and if Culver is with then another non shooter. They are just making it harder for our elite offensive players jobs harder.

Now if Wiseman became an All NBA talent I can see maybe how it would work because Wiseman could legit destroy the smaller matchup. (Still concerned that post defenders can "beat up" bigs just for 2 pts).

I just think the big has to be All NBA because teams can still consistently attack Kat in PnR. Also eliminates switching from the 4 spot now what is the easiest defense to have in the NBA.

I also want to say I dont think playing 2 bigs is a bad thing. I mean I wanted Kat and Vonleh to play together a lot last year. I just don't think it is smart to build around 2 bigs as 2 of your top 3 players. I just think Kat needs to improve at defense plain and simple.

I wouldn't have these negative feelings to drafting a big if Kat wasn't on this team

[Camden [enjin:6601484]]

Just a few thoughts, kek.

1. The difference between the opposition running a pick-and-roll with Towns at the four versus him at the five is mainly the way he'd be coached to defend it -- theoretically -- and who would be capable of erasing potential mistakes at the rim. I would hope that Towns would be coached to switch everything instead of trying to play drop coverage. When engaged, he can defend on the perimeter. Switching should be what he's instructed to do, in my opinion. His understanding of positioning and when to stunt/recover -- cat and mouse game -- is where I view his weaknesses now in defending that action. And if he blows the coverage, he'd have a potential eraser in Wiseman rotating over. Right now, Towns has Hernangomez as the last line of defense if he gets beat. That's a big difference.

2. I understand gameplanning for what opponents will do to attack you, but the Wolves need to think about how they can create their own mismatches. Having a dual-unicorn frontcourt, if you will, at least gives them the clear advantage in size and length. That translates into rebounds and should result in more forced turnovers -- meaning more possessions. And if the Clippers want to put Paul George on Towns or Wiseman -- or any other small ball lineup player -- then I say go for it. Towns has traditionally destroyed Draymond Green in their matchups. George wouldn't stand much of a chance.

3. We need to stop discussing Wiseman as a non-shooter. He can shoot it. He's not quite reliable from NBA three-point range, but he can hit 18-20 feet out and has a natural stroke with solid mechanics. His free throws stroke also shows potential with a 70% conversion in his three college games -- 6-7 FT, 9-14 FT, and 4-6 FT. Will he be another Towns? Obviously, no, but he could certainly grow into a Myles Turner type shooter.

[kekgeek]

Just a few thoughts, kek.

1. The difference between the opposition running a pick-and-roll with Towns at the four versus him at the five is mainly the way he'd be coached to defend it -- theoretically -- and who would be capable of erasing potential mistakes at the rim. I would hope that Towns would be coached to switch everything instead of trying to play drop coverage. When engaged, he can defend on the perimeter. Switching should be what he's instructed to do, in my opinion. His understanding of positioning and when to stunt/recover -- cat and mouse game -- is where I view his weaknesses now in defending that action. And if he blows the coverage, he'd have a potential eraser in Wiseman rotating over. Right now, Towns has Hernangomez as the last line of defense if he gets beat. That's a big difference.

2. I understand gameplanning for what opponents will do to attack you, but the Wolves need to think about how they can create their own mismatches. Having a dual-unicorn frontcourt, if you will, at least gives them the clear advantage in size and length. That translates into rebounds and should result in more forced turnovers -- meaning more possessions. And if the Clippers want to put Paul George on Towns or Wiseman -- or any other small ball lineup player -- then I say go for it. Towns has traditionally destroyed Draymond Green in their matchups. George wouldn't stand much of a chance.

3. We need to stop discussing Wiseman as a non-shooter. He can shoot it. He's not quite reliable from NBA three-point range, but he can hit 18-20 feet out and has a natural stroke with solid mechanics. His free throws stroke also shows potential with a 70% conversion in his three college games -- 6-7 FT, 9-14 FT, and 4-6 FT. Will he be another Towns? Obviously, no, but he could certainly grow into a Myles Turner type shooter.

Ya, I just think we are going to disagree on these things. I just want to address some things.

1) I agree with your points that Kat is going to have different principles playing PF, but do you really think that Kat is going to do well being switched on to PG in PnR or James Harden in PnRs. Just because Kat would play the 4 doesn't mean teams won't continue to attack Kat every single possession. Having a defensive big dosen't really change that. I think Kat would struggle mightily in playing the 4 on D.

2) Ya Kat feasts against Draymond. I mean Kat feasts against the majority of players in the NBA. My thing is I don't think teams will guard their smaller player on Kat. They are going to force Wiseman to beat them. Now maybe he can in post ups. But there is nothing in his college game to show Wiseman can face up and score. Also almost all of his post ups were drop steps and scores. Really didn't show any passing ability out of the post either. I just think teams will dare the Wolves to beat them with Wiseman trying to attack that matchup. I just don't think Wiseman is talented enough to win those matchups consistently or is it worth taking the ball out of Kat or Dlo hand.

3) Maybe, maybe not. You are right he is an ok FT shooter for a big and that is a plus. But according to thestepien.com he took a grand total of 4 shots outside the restriction area in his college career and he was 2/4 (0/1 from 3). You might be right that he develops into a good shooter or a respectable one but there is way to small of a sample size to show that he can consistently shoot jumpers.



This is all with the assumption that he is a good defender, even though every scouting report I read is that he really lacks defensive awareness and really struggles in defensive PnR. He does have all the physical tools to be very good on that end, I can't argue that. I just think it is hard to project defense in the NBA.


I think Wiseman will be a very good rim roller and a great rebounder in the NBA. The question is though does that help you win games. Im not exactly sure. I just think there is just way to many question marks with the mental side of his game, offensive potential, playmaking to go along with he plays the most devalued position in the NBA to use the top pick in the draft being used on him.

I could get behind the pick more if the Wolves didn't have Kat and could build players around Wiseman. I just don't think Wiseman fits with our All NBA player and I will be very disappointed if that is who Rosas picks on draft day.