Around the League - '24-25 Season

[Lipoli390]

The new trade landscape involves way fewer picks than before. Crazy how much we gave up for Rudy in retrospect.

It was a lot, but here is who we didn't have to give up (at the time): KAT, Ant, Jaden, and Naz. The result was a trip to the WCF and invaluable playoff experience for the latter three.

And here we sit lauding the defense of Jaylen Clark, complaining about playing time for Rob Dillingham, and how on earth can we get a look at TJ Shannon. The cupboard isn't so empty after all....

And that’s why I haven’t started a fire Tim Connelly thread. . I hated the Rudy trade and firmly believe we were going to be a contender without the Rudy deal based on how good were were the season before when Ant and Jaden were 19 and 20 years respectively and not nearly as good as they became two years later. The development of those two and Naz, along with the addition of Kessler and other things TC could have done with a fraction of the assets traded for Rudy and the financial flexibility we would have had were enough to eventually make us a contender and do so on a more sustainable basis. But alas we’ll never know.

What has kept me in TC’s corner in spite of that deal, and the KAT trade necessitated by the Rudy deal, are the positive things TC has done - the DLO deal for Mike Conley and 2nd round picks, getting NAW, and using the organization’s minimal draft resources to amass high upside talent in Dilly, TSJ, Clark, Minott and Miller. And while I hated the Rudy deal, it had logic and merit behind it unlike the recent Doncic deal. As angry as I was as a Wolves fan when the Rudy deal was announced, I would probably jump off a cliff if I were a Mavs fan. Rudy has helped this team a lot with his tremendous defense. He’s always been physically resilient.

[Lipoli390]

This kind of encapsulates my feelings on the trade:



Will Cain
@willcain
How does Luka get traded. Period.

How is he not shopped around?

How does no one in the league know he’s available?

How does he go to the Lakers like every other star?

How will the league recover from bad ratings? Oh…

I certainly seems suspicious. But I just don’t see how the League could get the Mavis to make an absolutely terrible deal. The League is just a collection of billionaire owners who competing against one another for the bragging rights of a championship. They can’t and wouldn’t empower Adam Silver to force one team to make a terrible deal with another. And even if they would, the League can’t force a team to make any deal. What would Adam do - threaten to kick Dallas out of the League?

Sometimes we tend to overthink things, become suspicious and find conspiracies when we see something that’s utterly ridiculous. But truth is, there are a lot of really stupid people who do stupid things.

I just think the Mavs’ GM is an idiot. I think he truly believes that Anthony Davis is as good as Luka but better defensively and that, in his words, “defense wins championships.” It’s the same thinking that prompted TC to give up a ton of assets for Rudy Gobert, but TC’s move was a reasonable calculation that included keeping all our key players and acquiring a guy known for being physically resilient and playing every game. The Mavs’ GM is probably just dumb and thought he was being really clever working this deal out quietly with the Lakers so no one else would swoop in and grab the often-injured, aging Anthony Davis. Or maybe the Mavs’ GM cut a deal to eventually become head of the Lakers’ organization, which would a scandal but not a League conspiracy. .

[kekgeek]

14 players have signed the supermax in the nba since 2017. I’ll be very curious on how that is going to effect teams with the new CBA.

1. Jaylen Brown (next year will be the year that will be super interesting when it comes to Celtics long term roster construction)

2. Curry (became a mid team because of it)

3. Westbrook (traded from the Thunder)

4. Giannis (having a really hard time building a legit contender)

5. Embiid (0 conference finals appearances and now one of the worst contracts in the league)

6. Jokic (middling West team)

7. Kat (traded from the wolves)

8. Rudy (traded from the Jazz)

9. Luka Doncic (traded from the Mavs and was up for another super max contract)

10. Lillard (traded from the blazers)

11. Wall (one of the worst contracts in NBA history)

12. Beal (worst contract in the current NBA)

13. Devin Booker (on a play in West Team)

14. Ant (on a middling West team)


Luka, SGA, Tatum are eligible for a supermax. Bam, Fox (just traded), BI, JJJ all technically could qualify this year but unlikely.

So only Jaylen Brown is on a legit contender and the Celtics are going to be in a really interesting spot next year.


These contracts kill teams and there is going to be a very difficult Ant conversation in 2 to 3 years if there are no changes to the CBA

[Lipoli390]

14 players have signed the supermax in the nba since 2017. I’ll be very curious on how that is going to effect teams with the new CBA.

1. Jaylen Brown (next year will be the year that will be super interesting when it comes to Celtics long term roster construction)

2. Curry (became a mid team because of it)

3. Westbrook (traded from the Thunder)

4. Giannis (having a really hard time building a legit contender)

5. Embiid (0 conference finals appearances and now one of the worst contracts in the league)

6. Jokic (middling West team)

7. Kat (traded from the wolves)

8. Rudy (traded from the Jazz)

9. Luka Doncic (traded from the Mavs and was up for another super max contract)

10. Lillard (traded from the blazers)

11. Wall (one of the worst contracts in NBA history)

12. Beal (worst contract in the current NBA)

13. Devin Booker (on a play in West Team)

14. Ant (on a middling West team)


Luka, SGA, Tatum are eligible for a supermax. Bam, Fox (just traded), BI, JJJ all technically could qualify this year but unlikely.

So only Jaylen Brown is on a legit contender and the Celtics are going to be in a really interesting spot next year.


These contracts kill teams and there is going to be a very difficult Ant conversation in 2 to 3 years if there are no changes to the CBA

Excellent post, kek!

[Phenom]

14 players have signed the supermax in the nba since 2017. I’ll be very curious on how that is going to effect teams with the new CBA.

1. Jaylen Brown (next year will be the year that will be super interesting when it comes to Celtics long term roster construction)

2. Curry (became a mid team because of it)

3. Westbrook (traded from the Thunder)

4. Giannis (having a really hard time building a legit contender)

5. Embiid (0 conference finals appearances and now one of the worst contracts in the league)

6. Jokic (middling West team)

7. Kat (traded from the wolves)

8. Rudy (traded from the Jazz)

9. Luka Doncic (traded from the Mavs and was up for another super max contract)

10. Lillard (traded from the blazers)

11. Wall (one of the worst contracts in NBA history)

12. Beal (worst contract in the current NBA)

13. Devin Booker (on a play in West Team)

14. Ant (on a middling West team)


Luka, SGA, Tatum are eligible for a supermax. Bam, Fox (just traded), BI, JJJ all technically could qualify this year but unlikely.

So only Jaylen Brown is on a legit contender and the Celtics are going to be in a really interesting spot next year.


These contracts kill teams and there is going to be a very difficult Ant conversation in 2 to 3 years if there are no changes to the CBA

Excellent post, kek!

Agreed and this is why I maintain that in order to really help teams keep their homegrown talent the league needs to exempt (from the cap) the extra money that can be offered by the hometown team.

[Q-is-here]

14 players have signed the supermax in the nba since 2017. I’ll be very curious on how that is going to effect teams with the new CBA.

1. Jaylen Brown (next year will be the year that will be super interesting when it comes to Celtics long term roster construction)

2. Curry (became a mid team because of it)

3. Westbrook (traded from the Thunder)

4. Giannis (having a really hard time building a legit contender)

5. Embiid (0 conference finals appearances and now one of the worst contracts in the league)

6. Jokic (middling West team)

7. Kat (traded from the wolves)

8. Rudy (traded from the Jazz)

9. Luka Doncic (traded from the Mavs and was up for another super max contract)

10. Lillard (traded from the blazers)

11. Wall (one of the worst contracts in NBA history)

12. Beal (worst contract in the current NBA)

13. Devin Booker (on a play in West Team)

14. Ant (on a middling West team)


Luka, SGA, Tatum are eligible for a supermax. Bam, Fox (just traded), BI, JJJ all technically could qualify this year but unlikely.

So only Jaylen Brown is on a legit contender and the Celtics are going to be in a really interesting spot next year.


These contracts kill teams and there is going to be a very difficult Ant conversation in 2 to 3 years if there are no changes to the CBA

Excellent post, kek!

Agreed and this is why I maintain that in order to really help teams keep their homegrown talent the league needs to exempt (from the cap) the extra money that can be offered by the hometown team.

Interesting.

As all this relates to drafting and undrafted rookies, there must be a burgeoning market for "ready now" upperclassmen that may not have a ton of upside, but can fairly quickly ramp up and be part of an NBA rotation as valuable role players while still early in their rookie contract.

I go back to NAW....do we really want to pay $15M for what is now our 8th man when our roster is fully healthy? Guys on rookie contracts need to fill that void.

[AbeVigodaLive]

This kind of encapsulates my feelings on the trade:



Will Cain
@willcain
How does Luka get traded. Period.

How is he not shopped around?

How does no one in the league know he’s available?

How does he go to the Lakers like every other star?

How will the league recover from bad ratings? Oh…

I certainly seems suspicious. But I just don’t see how the League could get the Mavis to make an absolutely terrible deal. The League is just a collection of billionaire owners who competing against one another for the bragging rights of a championship. They can’t and wouldn’t empower Adam Silver to force one team to make a terrible deal with another. And even if they would, the League can’t force a team to make any deal. What would Adam do - threaten to kick Dallas out of the League?

Sometimes we tend to overthink things, become suspicious and find conspiracies when we see something that’s utterly ridiculous. But truth is, there are a lot of really stupid people who do stupid things.

I just think the Mavs’ GM is an idiot. I think he truly believes that Anthony Davis is as good as Luka but better defensively and that, in his words, “defense wins championships.” It’s the same thinking that prompted TC to give up a ton of assets for Rudy Gobert, but TC’s move was a reasonable calculation that included keeping all our key players and acquiring a guy known for being physically resilient and playing every game. The Mavs’ GM is probably just dumb and thought he was being really clever working this deal out quietly with the Lakers so no one else would swoop in and grab the often-injured, aging Anthony Davis. Or maybe the Mavs’ GM cut a deal to eventually become head of the Lakers’ organization, which would a scandal but not a League conspiracy. .

NBA history is littered with really dumb decisions by inept front offices. Heck, Ted Stepien forced the NBA to create a rule named after him to protect dumb owners from themselves.

But this one is up there. Definitely.

It's not about the return, while I think it's entirely underwhelming and sorta ridiculous. It's that as others have noted... no other teams were contacted to create a bidding war. That's the DUMBEST part of all of this.

Even if the Mavs were deadset on Davis, getting other teams involved would have forced the Lakers to throw in more. And now this is the 2nd time that two different LA decision-making regimes have pulled off a one-sided blockbuster trade without any other teams contacted to up the ante.

In other news, the Lakers lead the NBA in free throw differential this season... AGAIN. Different players, different coaches, different schemes... but the Lakers continue being the one franchise able to figure out how to foul less than their opponent almost every night.

And now they're also the smartest at pulling off trades. Again.

Amazing how that happens.

[Q-is-here]

This kind of encapsulates my feelings on the trade:



Will Cain
@willcain
How does Luka get traded. Period.

How is he not shopped around?

How does no one in the league know he’s available?

How does he go to the Lakers like every other star?

How will the league recover from bad ratings? Oh…

I certainly seems suspicious. But I just don’t see how the League could get the Mavis to make an absolutely terrible deal. The League is just a collection of billionaire owners who competing against one another for the bragging rights of a championship. They can’t and wouldn’t empower Adam Silver to force one team to make a terrible deal with another. And even if they would, the League can’t force a team to make any deal. What would Adam do - threaten to kick Dallas out of the League?

Sometimes we tend to overthink things, become suspicious and find conspiracies when we see something that’s utterly ridiculous. But truth is, there are a lot of really stupid people who do stupid things.

I just think the Mavs’ GM is an idiot. I think he truly believes that Anthony Davis is as good as Luka but better defensively and that, in his words, “defense wins championships.” It’s the same thinking that prompted TC to give up a ton of assets for Rudy Gobert, but TC’s move was a reasonable calculation that included keeping all our key players and acquiring a guy known for being physically resilient and playing every game. The Mavs’ GM is probably just dumb and thought he was being really clever working this deal out quietly with the Lakers so no one else would swoop in and grab the often-injured, aging Anthony Davis. Or maybe the Mavs’ GM cut a deal to eventually become head of the Lakers’ organization, which would a scandal but not a League conspiracy. .

NBA history is littered with really dumb decisions by inept front offices. Heck, Ted Stepien forced the NBA to create a rule named after him to protect dumb owners from themselves.

But this one is up there. Definitely.

It's not about the return, while I think it's entirely underwhelming and sorta ridiculous. It's that as others have noted... no other teams were contacted to create a bidding war. That's the DUMBEST part of all of this.

Even if the Mavs were deadset on Davis, getting other teams involved would have forced the Lakers to throw in more. And now this is the 2nd time that two different LA decision-making regimes have pulled off a one-sided blockbuster trade without any other teams contacted to up the ante.

In other news, the Lakers lead the NBA in free throw differential this season... AGAIN. Different players, different coaches, different schemes... but the Lakers continue being the one franchise able to figure out how to foul less than their opponent almost every night.

And now they're also the smartest at pulling off trades. Again.

Amazing how that happens.

You made it back from Wisconsin! I went to the Dells once....came back a changed man....for the worse.

Assuming this isn't an NBA-orchestrated conspiracy and Silver was not aware of any of these talks, then the other two alternatives are: a) blatant incompetence by Nico Harrison by failing to do proper diligence in seeking other bids for Luka, or b) some sort of nefarious conspiracy between Pelinka, Harrison, Miriam Adelson (Mavs owner) and Jeannie Buss (Lakers owner) to do the Lakers a favor.

Can the NBA not step in and veto the deal like they did with the Chris Paul deal?

[AbeVigodaLive]

It sure makes you wonder, Cool. But I can’t believe an NBA owner with billions of dollars would do something against his team’s interests simply to accommodate Adam Silver. The League isn’t that powerful. Nevertheless, I have to believe Dallas could have gotten a much better return for Luka from some other team. Apparently, the Mavs are worried about Luka’s poor conditioning but Anthony Davis has been as physically fragile as a thin pane of glass and is entering the down slope of his career. Getting only one future first round pick way out in 2029 is chicken feed.

So I’m still left wondering, although I’m not ready to go down the conspiracy rabbit hole just yet. Maybe Luka told the Mavs he’s not going to opt in after next season. But that’s far enough out that it shouldn’t motivate the Mavs to trade him now. Moreover, there had to be teams out there willing to provide something better than AD and a 2029 first round pick return. Maybe the Mavs head of basketball operations is simply an idiot. Or maybe he’s been celebrating the growing legalization of recreational weed. It’s weird and it also sucks because it’s going to make the Lakers, the only NBA team I hate, much better and they’re already ahead of the Wolves in the standings.

But why always the Lakers? In the early 70's it was Wilt. Toward the end of the decade it was Kareem. Then Shaq, Pau, Lebron, and now Luka. Why are teams always so anxious to supplement the team in LA? Like you said Lip, is this really the best return they could have gotten? No way.

With Kyrie and AD at the end of their prime, how long before the Mavs are back in the lottery?

The Lakers signed Shaq and LeBron as free agents. You can simply attribute both to the Hollywood allure. The Lakers acquired Pau Gasol in a trade, but they gave up quite a lot for him - three players, including Aaron McKie, the drafts rights to Marc Gasol and two future first round picks. So three of the five acquisitions don’t seem troublesome or suspicious. The trade for Kareem seems pretty clearly one-sided in favor of the Lakers. This Luka deal looks even more one-sided. But there’s a 50-year gap between these two one-sided deals. During those 50 years, the Lakers have simply leveraged their free agent advantage as the glitzy team in America’s entertainment capitol with Southern California weather, wealth, celebrity and beaches. They also had a basketball genius, Jerry West, running the organization for many of those years. Jerry’s Lakers benefitted in a huge way from the stupidity of the many NBA GMs who passed on the chance to draft Kobe.

Nevertheless, I remain perplexed by this Luka deal. If I were a Dallas Mavs fan my head would be exploding right now.

That Gasol trade was very very bad. Especially when you look at that trade in the moment... and not what shockingly happened with Marc Gasol after it happened.

- Kwame Brown. One of the more infamous #1 pick busts. Was averaging 5.7 ppg for LAL when traded. Averaged 3.5 ppg in 15 games for Memphis. 1 start in Memphis career.
- Javaris Crittenton. Averaging 7.8 MINUTES at the time of the trade. Averaged 5.3 ppg in 113 career NBA games. Part of fun incident with Arenas in WAS. 0 starts in Memphis career.
- Aaron McKie. Had played a combined 24 games in 2006 and 2007. HE WAS RETIRED and was on the 76ers coaching staff. He came out of retirement to be traded. Never played an NBA game after the trade.
- first-round picks in 2008 and 2010. (#28) and (#28). Greivis Vasquez and Darrell Arthur ended up on the Grizzlies. Vasquez started 1 game as a rookie... was traded for Quincey Pondexter... who started 13 total games for Memphis over 4 seasons. NONE of these guys ever even averaged 10 ppg in Memphis.

- the draft rights to Marc Gasol. 3-time all star! 2-time all NBA!! DPOY!!!. All cool... but let's revisit 2008. Even after a successful season in Europe, he was still viewed (VALUED) as a #48 pick. His NBA skills were MUCH better than expected, which salvaged arguments based on revisionist history.

[AbeVigodaLive]

I certainly seems suspicious. But I just don’t see how the League could get the Mavis to make an absolutely terrible deal. The League is just a collection of billionaire owners who competing against one another for the bragging rights of a championship. They can’t and wouldn’t empower Adam Silver to force one team to make a terrible deal with another. And even if they would, the League can’t force a team to make any deal. What would Adam do - threaten to kick Dallas out of the League?

Sometimes we tend to overthink things, become suspicious and find conspiracies when we see something that’s utterly ridiculous. But truth is, there are a lot of really stupid people who do stupid things.

I just think the Mavs’ GM is an idiot. I think he truly believes that Anthony Davis is as good as Luka but better defensively and that, in his words, “defense wins championships.” It’s the same thinking that prompted TC to give up a ton of assets for Rudy Gobert, but TC’s move was a reasonable calculation that included keeping all our key players and acquiring a guy known for being physically resilient and playing every game. The Mavs’ GM is probably just dumb and thought he was being really clever working this deal out quietly with the Lakers so no one else would swoop in and grab the often-injured, aging Anthony Davis. Or maybe the Mavs’ GM cut a deal to eventually become head of the Lakers’ organization, which would a scandal but not a League conspiracy. .

NBA history is littered with really dumb decisions by inept front offices. Heck, Ted Stepien forced the NBA to create a rule named after him to protect dumb owners from themselves.

But this one is up there. Definitely.

It's not about the return, while I think it's entirely underwhelming and sorta ridiculous. It's that as others have noted... no other teams were contacted to create a bidding war. That's the DUMBEST part of all of this.

Even if the Mavs were deadset on Davis, getting other teams involved would have forced the Lakers to throw in more. And now this is the 2nd time that two different LA decision-making regimes have pulled off a one-sided blockbuster trade without any other teams contacted to up the ante.

In other news, the Lakers lead the NBA in free throw differential this season... AGAIN. Different players, different coaches, different schemes... but the Lakers continue being the one franchise able to figure out how to foul less than their opponent almost every night.

And now they're also the smartest at pulling off trades. Again.

Amazing how that happens.

You made it back from Wisconsin! I went to the Dells once....came back a changed man....for the worse.

Assuming this isn't an NBA-orchestrated conspiracy and Silver was not aware of any of these talks, then the other two alternatives are: a) blatant incompetence by Nico Harrison by failing to do proper diligence in seeking other bids for Luka, or b) some sort of nefarious conspiracy between Pelinka, Harrison, Miriam Adelson (Mavs owner) and Jeannie Buss (Lakers owner) to do the Lakers a favor.

Can the NBA not step in and veto the deal like they did with the Chris Paul deal?

Ha. Interestingly, I think the vetoed Chris Paul was probably better than the Paul Gasol or Luka Doncic trade... but with the NBA running the Hornets at the time... it was just a ridiculously awkward moment in time.