Starting PG Trade Options

[Lipoli390]

I think the two best small PGs as models for what Rob can be are Mike Conley and John Stockton. Both were essentially the same size as Rob when they entered the NBA although they were also a bit older than Rob. Both were excellent facilitators who could score and both were good defenders in spite of their size. The keys to their success defensively in my view were their high basketball IQs and toughness. We’ve already heard Finch and TC praise Rob’s toughness and I know I’ve seen it in his play on the court. I think he also has a high basketball IQs defensively as evidenced by what Finch described as him impressive growth on the defensive end. If you take some time as I did yesterday to watch a lot of Rob’s video highlights from this past season and college, you’ll see a really talented facilitator.

Rob is at least as quick and athletic as Mike Conley was in his prime and significantly more athletic than John Stockton. And Rob is clearly and elite ball-handler with terrific talent for change of direction with the ball. So he also has the basic physical attributes to be a great PG as well.

[Q-is-here]

I think the two best small PGs as models for what Rob can be are Mike Conley and John Stockton. Both were essentially the same size as Rob when they entered the NBA although they were also a bit older than Rob. Both were excellent facilitators who could score and both were good defenders in spite of their size. The keys to their success defensively in my view were their high basketball IQs and toughness. We’ve already heard Finch and TC praise Rob’s toughness and I know I’ve seen it in his play on the court. I think he also has a high basketball IQs defensively as evidenced by what Finch described as him impressive growth on the defensive end. If you take some time as I did yesterday to watch a lot of Rob’s video highlights from this past season and college, you’ll see a really talented facilitator.

Rob is at least as quick and athletic as Mike Conley was in his prime and significantly more athletic than John Stockton. And Rob is clearly and elite ball-handler with terrific talent for change of direction with the ball. So he also has the basic physical attributes to be a great PG as well.

Lip, I like your bullishness on Dillingham. I'm neutral to positive with a teaspoon of pessimism thrown in for good measure!

When making the comparison to Conley and Stockton, my concern is his turnovers. He had less than a 2:1 assist to turnover ratio both at Kentucky and his rookie year with the Wolves, which doesn't exactly scream natural point guard to me. That doesn't mean he can't improve, but how much? Are there examples of players that grew into natural point guards while at the NBA level?

[AbeVigodaLive]

Garland is a good player, and the Wolves would be fortunate if Dillingham ever reaches his level. Even so, Garland brings too many limitations with him (mostly size and D) than he'd be worth to get.

That being said... he was injured in the playoffs this season.

He sat out 4 games with a turf toe. When he returned, he shot 13 - 38 with 12 TOs over the next three games.

He's already had surgery and won't be back for 4 or 5 months.

Defensive Estimated Plus Minus is one of the "least bad" defensive metrics out there. Rob was in the 45th percentile in defensive EPM and Garland was in the 27th percentile.

In terms of Team Defensive Rating while on the floor (which is even more broad than EPM since it doesn't adjust for team mates), Garland's was a 113.4 and Dillingham's was a 111.1.

My conclusion is that Garland is indeed a poor defensive player, as it's not like he's stuck playing with a bunch of stiffs on that end and their ineptitude spills over to his stats. He played with a massive front line of defensive types.

I have no conclusion for Dillingham given the small sample size, but that goes both ways. I don't think we can conclude he's a good defensive player but we can't just assume he will be bad either. I thought he comported himself quite well on that side of the ball just from a pure eye test perspective, despite being a super young and physically underdeveloped rookie.

Dillingham is skinny, but as Lip has documented he really isn't that short. And it's a lot easier to put on weight than height!

I was pleasantly surprised quite a bit with Dillingham on defense. He competed really well. Don't know if that's enough... nor do I know if he'd work that hard in 20+ or 30+ mpg down the line when his playing time isn't as tied to it.

[AbeVigodaLive]

I think the two best small PGs as models for what Rob can be are Mike Conley and John Stockton. Both were essentially the same size as Rob when they entered the NBA although they were also a bit older than Rob. Both were excellent facilitators who could score and both were good defenders in spite of their size. The keys to their success defensively in my view were their high basketball IQs and toughness. We’ve already heard Finch and TC praise Rob’s toughness and I know I’ve seen it in his play on the court. I think he also has a high basketball IQs defensively as evidenced by what Finch described as him impressive growth on the defensive end. If you take some time as I did yesterday to watch a lot of Rob’s video highlights from this past season and college, you’ll see a really talented facilitator.

Rob is at least as quick and athletic as Mike Conley was in his prime and significantly more athletic than John Stockton. And Rob is clearly and elite ball-handler with terrific talent for change of direction with the ball. So he also has the basic physical attributes to be a great PG as well.

Can you explain the Stockton one a bit more?

The guy is one of the greatest PGs of all time... but beyond that... I don't see (m)any stylistic similarities with him and Dillingham either. It's also hard to compare since Stockton played in an entirely different era of NBA basketball.

I'm finding it more and more challenging to try to compare eras. The game has changed so much.



[Note: I think the Garland v. Dillingham comparison is the most apt in size, style, et al. Also... Garland played only 5 college games.]

[Sundog]

Garland just had surgery on his toe, and will be sidelined 4-5 months. According to Shams, Garland is likely to miss time to start the 2025-26 season, sources said. He was first diagnosed with the injury on March 23 in Utah and managed it to end the regular season before reaggravating and playing through the toe in the playoffs.

[Lipoli390]

I think the two best small PGs as models for what Rob can be are Mike Conley and John Stockton. Both were essentially the same size as Rob when they entered the NBA although they were also a bit older than Rob. Both were excellent facilitators who could score and both were good defenders in spite of their size. The keys to their success defensively in my view were their high basketball IQs and toughness. We’ve already heard Finch and TC praise Rob’s toughness and I know I’ve seen it in his play on the court. I think he also has a high basketball IQs defensively as evidenced by what Finch described as him impressive growth on the defensive end. If you take some time as I did yesterday to watch a lot of Rob’s video highlights from this past season and college, you’ll see a really talented facilitator.

Rob is at least as quick and athletic as Mike Conley was in his prime and significantly more athletic than John Stockton. And Rob is clearly and elite ball-handler with terrific talent for change of direction with the ball. So he also has the basic physical attributes to be a great PG as well.

Can you explain the Stockton one a bit more?

The guy is one of the greatest PGs of all time... but beyond that... I don't see (m)any stylistic similarities with him and Dillingham either. It's also hard to compare since Stockton played in an entirely different era of NBA basketball.

I'm finding it more and more challenging to try to compare eras. The game has changed so much.



[Note: I think the Garland v. Dillingham comparison is the most apt in size, style, et al. Also... Garland played only 5 college games.]

The main point of the comparison to Stockton was the fact that he was almost exactly the same height and weight as Dilly coming into the NBA. Stockton was a terrific three-point shooter as is Dilly. Stockton was also a terrific facilitator and good defender in spite of his size. Regarding era, Stockton’s era was not the 60s when Bob Cousy was considered athletic dribbling around the court with one hand. To the extent the NBA has more size and athleticism today, it’s worth noting that Dilly seems far more athletic than Stockton. Moreover, Stockton flourished in an era that was far more physical than today in spite of his size. I would think today’s less physical style would favor a smaller, quick and elusive PG like Dilly.

I think the comparison to Garland is a good one, but Dilly is significantly more athletic than Garland. I also think Dilly has better playmaking instincts than Garland, but that’s based on some pretty limited observations.

None of these comparisons are perfect. But Stockton is one of many great PGs in NBA history who was about Dilly’s size. Stockton and Chris Paul were also terrific defenders in spite of their size.

[Q-is-here]

Garland is a good player, and the Wolves would be fortunate if Dillingham ever reaches his level. Even so, Garland brings too many limitations with him (mostly size and D) than he'd be worth to get.

That being said... he was injured in the playoffs this season.

He sat out 4 games with a turf toe. When he returned, he shot 13 - 38 with 12 TOs over the next three games.

He's already had surgery and won't be back for 4 or 5 months.

Defensive Estimated Plus Minus is one of the "least bad" defensive metrics out there. Rob was in the 45th percentile in defensive EPM and Garland was in the 27th percentile.

In terms of Team Defensive Rating while on the floor (which is even more broad than EPM since it doesn't adjust for team mates), Garland's was a 113.4 and Dillingham's was a 111.1.

My conclusion is that Garland is indeed a poor defensive player, as it's not like he's stuck playing with a bunch of stiffs on that end and their ineptitude spills over to his stats. He played with a massive front line of defensive types.

I have no conclusion for Dillingham given the small sample size, but that goes both ways. I don't think we can conclude he's a good defensive player but we can't just assume he will be bad either. I thought he comported himself quite well on that side of the ball just from a pure eye test perspective, despite being a super young and physically underdeveloped rookie.

Dillingham is skinny, but as Lip has documented he really isn't that short. And it's a lot easier to put on weight than height!

I was pleasantly surprised quite a bit with Dillingham on defense. He competed really well. Don't know if that's enough... nor do I know if he'd work that hard in 20+ or 30+ mpg down the line when his playing time isn't as tied to it.

Right. It's a totally different ballgame if someday he is the starting PG. Then what does his defense look like?

All we can say right now is that he gave really good effort on that end in limited minutes and a limited role. That's at least a good starting point.

[Q-is-here]

Garland just had surgery on his toe, and will be sidelined 4-5 months. According to Shams, Garland is likely to miss time to start the 2025-26 season, sources said. He was first diagnosed with the injury on March 23 in Utah and managed it to end the regular season before reaggravating and playing through the toe in the playoffs.

I'm assuming this is Shams' account and not the sham account!

I hope this closes the door on any trade inquiries by the Wolves. DDV already weighs us down enough in the playoffs!

I know they are different players and I'm doing Garland a disservice, but I sort of feel like he's the sort of acquisition your franchise makes when you are trying to go from bad to mediocre, like when the Wolves traded for DLO. We got a professional PG and shot maker that helped elevate our offense and then moved off of him when it was clear he was no longer a fit for where the franchise needed to go after achieving basic competency.

[AbeVigodaLive]

I think the two best small PGs as models for what Rob can be are Mike Conley and John Stockton. Both were essentially the same size as Rob when they entered the NBA although they were also a bit older than Rob. Both were excellent facilitators who could score and both were good defenders in spite of their size. The keys to their success defensively in my view were their high basketball IQs and toughness. We’ve already heard Finch and TC praise Rob’s toughness and I know I’ve seen it in his play on the court. I think he also has a high basketball IQs defensively as evidenced by what Finch described as him impressive growth on the defensive end. If you take some time as I did yesterday to watch a lot of Rob’s video highlights from this past season and college, you’ll see a really talented facilitator.

Rob is at least as quick and athletic as Mike Conley was in his prime and significantly more athletic than John Stockton. And Rob is clearly and elite ball-handler with terrific talent for change of direction with the ball. So he also has the basic physical attributes to be a great PG as well.

Can you explain the Stockton one a bit more?

The guy is one of the greatest PGs of all time... but beyond that... I don't see (m)any stylistic similarities with him and Dillingham either. It's also hard to compare since Stockton played in an entirely different era of NBA basketball.

I'm finding it more and more challenging to try to compare eras. The game has changed so much.



[Note: I think the Garland v. Dillingham comparison is the most apt in size, style, et al. Also... Garland played only 5 college games.]

The main point of the comparison to Stockton was the fact that he was almost exactly the same height and weight as Dilly coming into the NBA. Stockton was a terrific three-point shooter as is Dilly. Stockton was also a terrific facilitator and good defender in spite of his size. Regarding era, Stockton’s era was not the 60s when Bob Cousy was considered athletic dribbling around the court with one hand. To the extent the NBA has more size and athleticism today, it’s worth noting that Dilly seems far more athletic than Stockton. Moreover, Stockton flourished in an era that was far more physical than today in spite of his size. I would think today’s less physical style would favor a smaller, quick and elusive PG like Dilly.

I think the comparison to Garland is a good one, but Dilly is significantly more athletic than Garland. I also think Dilly has better playmaking instincts than Garland, but that’s based on some pretty limited observations.

None of these comparisons are perfect. But Stockton is one of many great PGs in NBA history who was about Dilly’s size. Stockton and Chris Paul were also terrific defenders in spite of their size.

Again, the game is played entirely differently. Players train entirely differently.

Stockton would be hunted entirely differently in 2025 than in 1985 or 1995. He'd be switched on to Jordan and Pippen in the FInals a lot more. His contemporaries back then were other smaller guys like Thomas, Price, Kevin Johnson, Sleepy Floyd, Fat Lever, Johnny Dawkins, Mugsy Bogues, Spud Webb... and the list goes on.

Being listed at 6'1" and 170 wasn't the anomaly for high-level PGs back then.

And that being said, Stockton was one of the tougher SOBs to ever play the game (in a good way). And one of the most composed players in NBA history running an offense. I'm not seeing even slivers of that from Dillingham... yet. Since you're high on Dillingham's athleticism, you could maybe talk me into an Isiah Thomas comparison if I squint really really hard and get knocked over the head with a coconut first.

[Phenom]

Collin Sexton? Jazz want to stop talking. Send Rudy home with Donte for Sexton, Kessler and Clarkson.

Coby White for Donte and Minott

Anfernee Simons for Julius?